Monday, 2008-07-14

tvolgreg-g carrying wine on your back? sounds heavy00:03
greg-gtvol: only one bottle, I got 3 today on my way back home.  Everything started to taste the same yesterday so I didn't want to buy much00:11
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay01:00
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jibotBovinity is brilliant and aware of Basement Cat, and iz not afraid.01:03
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jibotmlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons02:27
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay03:22
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jibotdavidstrauss is "P" and not "P"05:01
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jibotrejon is a killer MC from staten island and is the 10th member of the wutang clan and http://www.rejon.org/07:03
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* hdworak waves07:25
hdworakpaulproteus: I can see you've probably completed my midterm survey by now07:25
paulproteushdworak, Yup - all good to go, and if Google doesn't forward you my remarks I'll give them to you.07:26
hdworakwell, as far as I can tell Google forwards my survey to nathany07:27
paulproteusI'm going to bed in a sec - it's 3:30 here.07:27
hdworaklol :)07:27
hdworakcrazy IT people07:27
hdworakyou should have done so five and a half hours ago ;)07:27
hdworakgood night then07:28
paulproteusI was too busy staying up, reading http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/07/21/080721fa_fact_lizza .07:29
hdworakI'm not a US citizen07:32
hdworakbut Sen. Obama sure gets my vote07:33
hdworakloved his recent speech on patriotism "period. full stop."07:33
hdworakgreat rhetoric07:33
hdworakit was also funny when he had this video recorded in Google headquarters07:34
hdworakand Dr. Schmidt asks him how to sort one billion queries07:35
hdworakand he replied "I think bubble sort would be a wrong way to go"07:35
hdworaklol :)07:35
hdworakthough if one needs serious arguments, I recommend Prof. Lessig's multimedia presentation on why to vote for Obama07:37
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is4paulproteus, in bed yet?07:59
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jibotnathany is teh preacher of teh gozpl of teh Ceiling Cat and witness to teh menny divine miraclz of Ceiling Cat14:16
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jibotBovinity is brilliant and aware of Basement Cat, and iz not afraid.15:25
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jibotSteren is sitting next to greg-g and from Nancy15:58
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jibotdavidstrauss is "P" and not "P"15:59
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jibotrejon is a killer MC from staten island and is the 10th member of the wutang clan and http://www.rejon.org/16:21
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jibotBovinity is brilliant and aware of Basement Cat, and iz not afraid.16:32
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jibotftobia is the other tech intern at Creative Commons and head of RPI Free Culture16:33
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jibotcurrybot is currytastic and <3 fair use16:35
currybotjibot: mmm... curry...16:35
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jibotmlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons16:50
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jibotjonsson is a Swedish lawyer working for CC Sweden and blogging @@ http://www.cyberlaw.se/kalle17:05
greg-gmmmm, memory17:11
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Bovinitycurrybot: 317:36
currybotPISTA MURG (Boneless chicken cubes cooked in a pistachio curry sauce) This dish comes from the heart of India the capital New Delhi; chicken cubes are sautéed with pistachio paste. The base sauce is prepared with, coriander, cumin, cloves, cardamom, cinnamon, mace, garlic, ginger, vine ripened tomatoes, red onions and many expensive masala.17:36
currybot$ 5.0017:36
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greg-gcurrybot list17:46
currybot(1) CHANNA SAAG (Garbanzo beans cooked with fresh spinach puree)17:46
currybot(2) PUNJABI SUBZI (Fresh vegetables cooked with red onions, tomatoes, and spices in a heavy iron utensil)17:46
currybot(3) PISTA MURG (Boneless chicken cubes cooked in a pistachio curry sauce)17:46
currybot(4) TOMATO CINNAMON MEATBALL MASALA (CHEF’S SPECIAL)17:46
ftobiammm, heavy iron utensil17:50
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay17:56
ftobianathany: i've got some conceptual questions about how cc.license should be implemented; do you have time for a brief meeting before lunch?17:59
nathanysure17:59
nathanyone second17:59
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jibotrejon is a killer MC from staten island and is the 10th member of the wutang clan and http://www.rejon.org/18:03
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nathanyftobia: http://code.creativecommons.org/viewsvn/ccooo/trunk/src/org/creativecommons/license/Chooser.java?view=markup18:29
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Gnutoohello, is sampling legal when you do it without the authorization of the author?18:33
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hdworakhello18:39
Bovinityhdworak: fyi, proteus is on vacation today, probably won't be in irc18:40
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hdworakBovinity: thank you. that's fine, 'cause I've passed the midterm18:43
hdworakhow about ankitg? how's it going, buddy?18:43
ankitghdworak: Alohey18:44
* ankitg passed the mid-term too ... (-:18:44
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hdworakcongratulations!18:45
hdworakwell done18:45
nathanycurrybot: 318:45
currybotPISTA MURG (Boneless chicken cubes cooked in a pistachio curry sauce) This dish comes from the heart of India the capital New Delhi; chicken cubes are sautéed with pistachio paste. The base sauce is prepared with, coriander, cumin, cloves, cardamom, cinnamon, mace, garlic, ginger, vine ripened tomatoes, red onions and many expensive masala.18:45
currybot$ 5.0018:45
nathanycurrybot: list18:46
currybot(1) CHANNA SAAG (Garbanzo beans cooked with fresh spinach puree)18:46
currybot(2) PUNJABI SUBZI (Fresh vegetables cooked with red onions, tomatoes, and spices in a heavy iron utensil)18:46
currybot(3) PISTA MURG (Boneless chicken cubes cooked in a pistachio curry sauce)18:46
currybot(4) TOMATO CINNAMON MEATBALL MASALA (CHEF’S SPECIAL)18:46
nathanycurrybot: 218:46
currybotPUNJABI SUBZI (Fresh vegetables cooked with red onions, tomatoes, and spices in a heavy iron utensil) Kadhai is a heavy iron, wide rim wok like Indian cooking utensils and very popular northern dish. In this style of cooking, all the ingredients are stirred upside down in speed until done. Assortment of vegetables in this dish are blue lake bean, carrots, eggplants, bell pepper, cut corns and mushrooms18:46
currybot$5.0018:46
nathanyupside down in speed! i love that!18:46
mirkomsg currybot help18:46
Bovinitysomething about a meth lab in the back room of mehfil...18:47
nathanymirko: the currybot doesn't help :)18:47
mirkowhat a shame18:47
mirkoI am hungry18:47
ankitghdworak: heh, I am assuming, passing the mid-term is more like, "You've still got work to do. Continue" :P18:47
hdworakthere's no reason not to celebrate18:48
hdworakit's like passing your first semester at Univ.18:48
hdworakyou still have a lot ahead of you, but...18:48
greg-gcurrybot: Order - Type:Delivery What:1+2 Who:Greg When:12:1518:48
currybotgreg-g: mmm... curry...18:48
ankitgoh, I don't think I need to reason to celebrate ... :D18:48
* egg plants, bell pepper, ...18:48
hdworake\gg18:49
egg:)18:49
hdworak:)18:49
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hdworakBovinity: when will paulproteus go back from the vacation?18:55
paulproteusTomorrow.18:55
hdworaklol18:56
hdworak:)18:56
hdworakI should have written paul\proteus18:56
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ftobialist19:07
ftobiacurrybot: list19:07
currybot(1) CHANNA SAAG (Garbanzo beans cooked with fresh spinach puree)19:07
currybot(2) PUNJABI SUBZI (Fresh vegetables cooked with red onions, tomatoes, and spices in a heavy iron utensil)19:07
currybot(3) PISTA MURG (Boneless chicken cubes cooked in a pistachio curry sauce)19:07
currybot(4) TOMATO CINNAMON MEATBALL MASALA (CHEF’S SPECIAL)19:07
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tim_hwangcurrybot list19:08
currybot(1) CHANNA SAAG (Garbanzo beans cooked with fresh spinach puree)19:08
currybot(2) PUNJABI SUBZI (Fresh vegetables cooked with red onions, tomatoes, and spices in a heavy iron utensil)19:08
currybot(3) PISTA MURG (Boneless chicken cubes cooked in a pistachio curry sauce)19:08
currybot(4) TOMATO CINNAMON MEATBALL MASALA (CHEF’S SPECIAL)19:08
ftobiacurrybot: 219:08
currybotPUNJABI SUBZI (Fresh vegetables cooked with red onions, tomatoes, and spices in a heavy iron utensil) Kadhai is a heavy iron, wide rim wok like Indian cooking utensils and very popular northern dish. In this style of cooking, all the ingredients are stirred upside down in speed until done. Assortment of vegetables in this dish are blue lake bean, carrots, eggplants, bell pepper, cut corns and mushrooms19:08
currybot$5.0019:08
ftobiacurrybot: 119:08
currybotCHANNA SAAG (Garbanzo beans cooked with fresh spinach puree) This is a very popular dish from Punjab the northern part of India. Here garbanzo beans are first cooked in a ginger, garlic and tomato based curry and then fresh spinach puree is added to the beans and cooked well so that the flavor of both mixes with each other.19:08
currybot$5.0019:08
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jibotmlinksva is Mike Linksvayer and from Creative Commons19:26
paulproteusmlinksva, How do I become part of the "We hate the centralized web" cabal?19:26
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Gnutoohello, is sampling legal when you do it without the authorization of the author?19:50
Gnutoobecause i saw some samples in a creative common song in jamendo19:50
mlinksvapaulproteus: i'll check on that19:56
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nathanyGnutoo: any reuse is legal if the author gives you explicit permission19:59
Gnutoonathany, ok so maby i should find the original song(because i heard it in a rap song so i think it was not the original one) and bugreport to jamendo20:02
Gnutoonathany, thanks a lot20:02
nathanysure, maybe they have permission or maybe it's small enough to fall into fair use20:02
nathanyhard to say20:02
Gnutooyes it's small20:02
Gnutoobut it's repetitive20:02
Gnutoook thanks a lot20:02
Gnutooit's 5 seconds long but it's repeated in all the song20:03
nathanyGnutoo: ok; IANAL but my understanding is that it's the length, not repetition that matters20:04
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nathanybut Jamendo would be the right venue to bring it up20:05
nkinkadenathany: Bovinity: Can either of you think of a reason why a7 shouldn't go 64bit today?20:06
nkinkadeDNS has had all weekend to converge.20:06
nathanynkinkade: all is quiet on the western front?20:06
nathany(ie, logs)20:07
nkinkadeWell, at the moment about the only activity is from 1 IP address: 189.108.6.2, which made over 350,000 requests in less than minute.20:07
nkinkadeQuite astonishing, and I'm not sure what it's all about.20:08
nkinkadeMaybe it's a renegade crawl.20:08
nkinkadeFortunately for use there were only 2 things on a7.  CC.org and SC.org, and those are both now running okay on a5.20:10
nkinkadeThe only thing that comes to mind are cron jobs, which I'll double check.20:10
paulproteusHeh.20:14
paulproteusnkinkade, http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/jokes/bljokebushbrazilian.htm20:15
paulproteus(the IP is Brazilian)20:16
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Sterennathany: rejon : I've added a "Sort by edit time" in the case study page : http://wiki.creativecommons.org/Casestudies . I'm affraid that the Edit time considered is not the last one but the last-1 one ... I really don't know how to put the last one in the semantic data.20:22
nathanySteren: is that because of the order the hooks are called in? (ie,  the last edit hasn't actually happened when your hook is called)20:23
Sterennathany: exaclty20:23
nathanytwo ideas:20:23
Sterensemantics are crated during parsing, and the revision is created after article save20:23
nathanyright20:23
nathanyso one idea is to look for a hidden form variable that MW sets when editing to record the edit start time (and help with collision detection) and use that20:24
nathanythe other would be to just use the actual time (which should be close to the actual revision time)20:24
SterenI alreadyu tried actual time20:24
nathanyoh?20:24
nathanydidn't work?20:24
Sterenbut it's buggy because sometimes semantics are refreshed20:24
Sterenthis works fine, but 5 days later, hop when you display the page, it's refreshed20:25
nathany:(20:26
rejon:(20:26
rejoncool Steren though...is this because of caching this problem?20:26
Sterenactual time is not so reliable I think, mainly because of the semantic refresh system20:27
Sterenrejon: what do you mean ?20:27
rejonthat the page has to be refreshed to get the last edit?20:27
Sterenno in fact semantic data is stored in a database, those data are created fromthe last revision info20:27
Sterenbut when they are created the last last revision hasn't been yet20:28
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Sterenthe order is : Edit > Store semantic data > create last revision20:28
Sterennathany: Before today I was convinced that actual timestamp was ok, but this morning I tried my local wiki, and everypage had an edit time from today. I don't really understand why20:30
nathanythat's really weird20:31
nathanydid you run something like the SMW_RefreshData.php script?20:31
nathanyi can see how running that would cause all the edit dates to be reset20:31
nathany(which would be undesirable)20:31
SterenI don't think so20:32
Sterenwe can test it on the CC wiki20:32
SterenI just have to uncomment some lines and comment others to see20:32
nathanyyeah, might be worth playing with a bit in a live situation... maybe on Teamspace?20:33
nathany(in case it blows up?)20:34
nathanywhichever is fine with me20:34
Sterenok I'll re-test it on my local machine20:34
SterenAs I told you, for our last stand up meeting, actual timewas what I used because of the revision problem20:34
Sterenand it worked20:34
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Sterennathany: yeah it works well on my machine. I tried on the CCwiki, and it works.20:45
nathanycool20:45
nathanyi guess we'll just keep an eye on it and see if it blows up :)20:46
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nathanySteren: something weird happens when you preview a page21:12
nathanytons of fact boxes21:12
nathany(did you tell me about this before and I just forgot?)21:12
Sterenyes, an update to semantic MW 1.2 corrects this21:12
nathanyoh, right21:13
ftobiapaulproteus: ping21:13
Sterennathany: I'm trying to figure out why it works, because the parser and factbox printing is called everytime a page is displayed21:14
paulproteusftobia, pong if you insist.21:14
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paulproteus(pretending to be away)21:14
ftobiawell after my quick question you can continue pretending21:14
paulproteusGreat.21:14
greg-gpaulproteus: your /whois doesn't say you are away ;)21:14
ftobiaso after a discussion with nathany, and reading the selector code, i think it would be best to have a single License class instead of StandardLicense, PdLicense, SamplingLicense21:15
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paulproteusftobia, Okay, I think I may have said that 3mo ago anyway.21:15
ftobiawoot21:15
paulproteusWhat's the q?21:15
ftobiais there some good reason for having separate classes?21:16
ftobianathan's idea is that the selector will pass a uri to the License constructor, which queries RDF to fill in all the values.21:16
paulproteusI like that.21:17
ftobiaexcellent. thanks.21:17
ftobianow switch your status :)21:17
paulproteusBut I'm chatting on #laconica! (-;21:17
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Sterennathany: I think the "EditTime and revision User" task is completed, do you have something for me in mind ?21:35
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nathanyi have a couple things in the back of my mind, can you follow up on getting semantic tasks into mediawiki this afternoon and we'll talk about it first thing tomorrow?21:35
nathanySteren: ^^21:36
nathanySteren: i forget, do you know python?21:37
Sterennathany: I don't, but I definitively would like to learn, this learning could be done apart from my CChours of course21:38
nathany:)21:38
nkinkadeBovinity: http://mirrors.creativecommons.org/presskit/cc.primary.srr.svg ... do you know what that's a 404?21:38
nkinkadeIt doesn't appear to be on mirrors, but it must have been at some point.21:38
nathanyok, give me 10 minutes and then let's talk about a task that needs done21:38
Bovinityhm, it was tehre when i added it21:38
nkinkadeAnd also the .eps version is gone.21:38
Bovinityoh, cc.srr.primary, not cc.primary.21:39
Bovinitymy bad21:39
nkinkadeMaybe it had something to do with the move?21:39
Bovinitythe gif is cc.primary21:39
nkinkadeOh.  I saw those in there, but wasn't sure what was up.21:39
nkinkadeSo it's just a URL issue?  I'll change it.21:39
nkinkadeOr will you?21:39
Bovinityupdating presskit page21:39
nkinkadeCool.  Thanks.21:40
nkinkadeThis just came into info@ "I understand everything there is to know about cc, except for the start, the meaning of 'copyright'."21:40
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jibotmattl is Matt Lee, British comedy boy, GNU Project Chief Webmaster, founder of CNUK.ORG and occasional mischief maker. He hates bots.21:52
mattlmlinksva: hey21:52
mattlmlinksva: http://yro.slashdot.org/firehose.pl?id=771363&op=view21:52
mattlhttp://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/07/14/201925321:52
rejoncool mattl21:54
rejonwhat a day!21:54
mlinksvamattl: i'm slow, looks like it's already on the /. homepage21:54
mattlyah, just came up.21:54
mattlrejon: you missed the part of me hammering the shit out of mako's box to make sure it'll stay up.21:55
rejon:)21:55
rejonaha, I hate to miss hammering the shit out of any type of tech21:55
paulproteusmattl, I've been trying for hours to comment on that post.21:56
paulproteusThe comment form never shows up for me.21:56
mattlpaulproteus: yeah, it's locked down right now. a) caching reasons 2) to keep riff-raff like you out ;)21:56
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* paulproteus frowns at mattl 21:57
mattlpaulproteus: caching. honest.21:57
mattlno HOPE for me. various reasons.21:58
mattlbut the good news is that us.gov want to get all my biometrics on 7/30 so, progress.21:58
paulproteusSorry to hear it.  Anyway, let me know as soon as caching's off so I can be #16 not like #16000.21:58
mattlyeah.21:59
mattli'm tempted to just insert myself in the database now.22:00
paulproteusI'd love it if you'd do that ofr me.22:00
mattldon't worry. we can juggle that around later.22:00
paulproteusmattl, I'm going to go get dinner, so I'd appreciate it if you'd let me comment or just INSERT me. (-:22:03
mattlpaulproteus: we'll sorry about it later. for now, slashdot > you, sorry dude.22:03
paulproteusI tried to comment before the Slush dotting.22:04
* paulproteus sniffles22:04
paulproteusAllergies.22:04
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nkinkadenathany: Bovinity: paulproteus: Unless any of you object, I'm going to start the conversion of a7 to 64 bit.22:06
Bovinitynkinkade: cc.org is living where for now?22:06
nkinkadea522:06
nathanygo22:06
Bovinityok22:06
nkinkadeBovinity: a5 is it's permanent home.22:06
paulproteusgo go gadget 64 bits22:06
Bovinityoh, well ain't htat fancy22:07
paulproteusGo go Debian servers!  You mighty, arch-morphing Debian serve-er-ers.22:07
nkinkadeThe only thing I can see trying to connect is something with a weird From: header that reads webmaster@microsiga.com.br22:07
mattlpaulproteus: i have commented out the 'endorsements' and comments login bit for now, while we're in cache mode.22:08
* paulproteus sighs22:08
paulproteusTalk to you post-dinner.22:08
mattlpaulproteus: dude. be reasonable here :)22:09
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greg-gsmoothies22:21
*** ftobia is now known as smoothiebot22:21
smoothiebotit's smoothie time!22:21
smoothiebotmmm, smoothies...22:21
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tim_hwangsmoothiebot list22:53
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nkinkadepaulproteus: ?23:11
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