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| paulproteus | nathany, The nathany, http://search.creativecommons.org/?request=update&lang=zh_TW problem was a case-sensitive compare, that's all. | 12:37 |
|---|---|---|
| paulproteus | Fixed now. | 12:37 |
| nathany | ah, great | 12:37 |
| paulproteus | Mike asked "Could the language drop down expose language names instead of language codes to the end user". | 12:37 |
| nathany | thanks, paulproteus | 12:37 |
| paulproteus | Where should I be getting language names? | 12:37 |
| nathany | right | 12:37 |
| nathany | paulproteus: i just updated TODO | 12:47 |
| * paulproteus nods | 12:47 | |
| nkinkade | paulproteus: what was the paste command in bash after Ctrl-w? | 12:59 |
| paulproteus | Ctrl-y(ank) | 12:59 |
| paulproteus | You should just learn Emacs one of these days. | 12:59 |
| paulproteus | Then you'd be bash native. | 12:59 |
| nkinkade | Probably. | 12:59 |
| paulproteus | Besides, you'll want it for nxml-mode. | 12:59 |
| nkinkade | But the word "yank" doesn't make sense in this case, though it does work. | 13:00 |
| paulproteus | Sure, but that's the Emacs name for paste. | 13:00 |
| nkinkade | In vi "yank" mean cut, basically. | 13:00 |
| paulproteus | I'm not sayin' it makes sense, I'm just sayin'. | 13:00 |
| nkinkade | which seems more lexically standard. | 13:00 |
| paulproteus | Unlike your neck. | 13:00 |
| nkinkade | I'll accept that Ctrl-y does it, but I can't accept that it means yank. | 13:01 |
| Bovinity | there's a lot of sayin' being sayd. | 13:01 |
| nkinkade | neck? | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Rocky Horror callback reference. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Hmm, "callback reference". | 13:01 |
| nkinkade | Went right over my head. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Anyway. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Just like your neck! | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Er, also unlike your neck, actually. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Bovinity, It's valid to put <script></script> in the head of XHTML, right? | 13:05 |
| Bovinity | yes | 13:05 |
| Bovinity | <script type="text/javascript"> | 13:05 |
| paulproteus | Super rad. | 13:05 |
| paulproteus | And I'll pad it with CDATA and everything. | 13:05 |
| Bovinity | xhtml-tastic | 13:05 |
| paulproteus | <script type="text/javascript"> | 13:06 |
| paulproteus | /* <![CDATA[ */ | 13:06 |
| paulproteus | var d = "<?php echo ('Enter search query');?>"; | 13:06 |
| paulproteus | /* ]]> */ | 13:06 |
| paulproteus | </script> | 13:06 |
| paulproteus | Run for your lives, the nesting is coming. | 13:06 |
| paulproteus | Bovinity, re: search.cc CSS, Bob at CC TW writes: | 13:11 |
| paulproteus | from Bob @ CC TW: The font size of strings like "remove frame" is too small for Chinese characters (see the attachment), however it is acceptable to English and other latin letters... about 12-14px would be better (for #options, in #footer we could use 11-12px). | 13:11 |
| Bovinity | 12-14px for chinese? | 13:12 |
| paulproteus | This is what nathany wrote in the ccsearch TODO verbatim. | 13:12 |
| Bovinity | would it be easy to do a conditional <style></style> in the php based on country code? | 13:12 |
| paulproteus | Um. | 13:12 |
| paulproteus | Not super easy, but possible if necessary. | 13:13 |
| Bovinity | if (chinese) { ?> <style>...</style> <? } ?> | 13:13 |
| paulproteus | Is that really the best thing to do? | 13:13 |
| * Bovinity goes to see how awful it might look for the default ot be bigger... | 13:13 | |
| paulproteus | nathany, Turns out I was wrong that you modifying TODO is better than sending me email, since I seem to have responses. | 13:14 |
| nathany | paulproteus: was the person who brought up pdflicensemanager using it as a gui tool or from java? | 13:15 |
| paulproteus | nathany, They were using it headless. | 13:16 |
| nathany | paulproteus: ok | 13:16 |
| paulproteus | Note that the JAR works headlessly. | 13:16 |
| paulproteus | Also he had local patches. | 13:16 |
| nathany | headlessly as in as a standalone cli tool or as a java library? | 13:16 |
| paulproteus | And probably wasn't using a distributed revision control system, o woe is us! | 13:16 |
| paulproteus | Good question; I think standalone CLI from some shell scripts but I'm not totally sure. | 13:16 |
| Bovinity | eh. it was 0.8em; 0.9em is better and still looks acceptable | 13:16 |
| nathany | if the former why don't we just kill it in favor of liblicense? | 13:16 |
| paulproteus | nathany, I mentioned liblicense, but our "killing it" won't really kill it (esp because it probably has users in Javaland). | 13:17 |
| paulproteus | You know, like giving out needles to drug users. | 13:18 |
| paulproteus | End the harm if you can't end the habit. | 13:18 |
| Bovinity | paulproteus: fixed the css on a5:search.css | 13:18 |
| Bovinity | search.cc | 13:18 |
| paulproteus | Bovinity, Er, fix it in an svn checkout and commit? | 13:19 |
| paulproteus | Oh, fine, I'll do it. (-: | 13:19 |
| paulproteus | nathany, re: ML's desired changes: Should/must those be translated strings? | 13:19 |
| nathany | for the iframe? | 13:20 |
| paulproteus | Yeah. | 13:20 |
| nathany | yes | 13:20 |
| paulproteus | One translation string per paragraph of HTML, right? | 13:22 |
| paulproteus | And what's this about columns - that should require Alex's CSS help, right? | 13:22 |
| paulproteus | AKA, I think that email should be forwarded to Alex for him to do. | 13:26 |
| Bovinity | oops, totally forgot we're not using writable checkouts | 13:28 |
| paulproteus | Bovinity, committed, no worries. | 13:28 |
| paulproteus | nathany, Is there a standard server-side path I can expect cc_org to be, or should I add it as an svn:external? | 13:30 |
| paulproteus | (the cc_org po/mo files, that is) | 13:30 |
| nathany | svn:external, i think | 13:30 |
| paulproteus | Great. | 13:30 |
| * paulproteus attaches to cc_org trunk | 13:32 | |
| paulproteus | Why does cc_org not seem to have LC_MESSAGES directories? I guess I'm supposed to mkdir them myself, and put the compiled .mo files in myself. | 13:34 |
| nathany | paulproteus: no LC_MESSAGES because... er, don't remember; probably because the existing tooling didn't need them | 13:43 |
| paulproteus | Heh, okay. | 13:43 |
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| paulproteus | nathany, I'm about to head to lunch. You will email Bovinity the intro.html changes, and he'll do the design/text changing, and I'll then worry about i18n, okay? | 13:53 |
| paulproteus | (ML's suggested iframe text changes, that is) | 13:53 |
| nathany | uh, ok | 13:53 |
| paulproteus | Well, it involves a "left side" and a "right side". | 13:54 |
| Bovinity | hmm | 13:54 |
| paulproteus | That sounds like CSS tricks to me. | 13:54 |
| Bovinity | same content as the email mike sent last week? | 13:54 |
| paulproteus | Oh, right. | 13:54 |
| paulproteus | Yes, but I'm keeping bad track of mail. | 13:54 |
| paulproteus | Well, Bovinity, I eagerly await those changes so I can i18n them. (-: | 13:54 |
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| Bovinity | is EAGER a new priority status? ;) | 13:55 |
| * paulproteus vanishes in a puff of lunch plans. | 13:57 | |
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| Bovinity | nathany: the term we were searching for was apparently "Kiropracs" :P http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/funny-pictures-bunny-chiropracter.jpg | 13:59 |
| qubodup | hello, is by any chance the host of http://openfontlibrary.org/ here? | 13:59 |
| nathany | Bovinity: i saw | 13:59 |
| nathany | qubodup: you want rejon; he's not online right now | 13:59 |
| qubodup | nathany: aye thanks. maybe someone who has admin rights to it? | 14:00 |
| nathany | qubodup: we don't have any official affiliation with the site, so no one that i know of | 14:00 |
| Bovinity | none of the usual OCAL/OFL suspects appear to be around right now | 14:01 |
| nathany | Bovinity: just emailed you the iframe text | 14:01 |
| Bovinity | great, thx | 14:01 |
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| qubodup | whom should I talk about future plans on the design of cchost here? =) | 14:02 |
| qubodup | s/talk/talk to/ | 14:03 |
| nathany | qubodup: rejon | 14:03 |
| qubodup | oh | 14:03 |
| qubodup | allright, thanks for the directions | 14:03 |
| nathany | np | 14:03 |
| nathany | Bovinity: check out the tabs on http://teamspace.creativecommons.org/Technology | 14:11 |
| nathany | improvement? | 14:11 |
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| Bovinity | nice | 14:12 |
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| nathany | paulproteus: http://teamspace.creativecommons.org/Technology | 16:18 |
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| paulproteus | http://www.slate.com/id/2081042/ - search for "relatively modest cost" | 16:37 |
| paulproteus | The other ones are good, too. | 16:37 |
| paulproteus | If desired I can do a reading. | 16:37 |
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| nkinkade | Bovinity: have you made any changes to the creativecommons.php plugin lately? | 16:56 |
| Bovinity | no | 16:56 |
| nkinkade | Getting this at learn.(cc).org: Warning: array_multisort() [<a href='function.array-multisort'>function.array-multisort</a>]: Argument #1 is expected to be an array or a sort flag | 16:56 |
| nkinkade | If you haven't made any changes then I'll look into it right now. | 16:57 |
| paulproteus | nkinkade, Shift-reload maybe, though. | 17:01 |
| paulproteus | nathany, So, um, PHP question. | 17:04 |
| paulproteus | I can't find a getlocale() to get the locale. | 17:04 |
| nathany | uh, ok | 17:04 |
| paulproteus | I figured I'd temporarily change the locale with setlocale() to the language we're given. | 17:04 |
| nathany | i'm listening to Billy Idol so there's a chance i'll be able to answer | 17:04 |
| nathany | right | 17:04 |
| paulproteus | But, um, I can't find out how to actually find the current locale so I wouldn't know what to set it back to! | 17:04 |
| nathany | paulproteus: http://php-flp.sourceforge.net/getting_started_english.htm#getting | 17:09 |
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| paulproteus | nkinkade, omg bbq http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/574 | 17:13 |
| nathany | paulproteus: fyi i updated the translations | 17:26 |
| paulproteus | Yippee. | 17:27 |
| ya | hallo | 17:29 |
| ya | Creative Commons Attribution-Sharealike 2.0 license (a.k.a. CC-BY-SA) | 17:29 |
| ya | This is a copyleft free license that is good for artistic and entertainment works, and educational works. Please don't use it for software or documentation, since it is incompatible with the GNU GPL and with the GNU FDL. | 17:30 |
| ya | could you please tell me why is it incompatible with the gpl and fdl ? | 17:30 |
| nathany | ya: it has no source code requirement (which something like GPL does) | 17:42 |
| nathany | and it's not compatible with FDL because nothing is ;) | 17:43 |
| ya | nathany, but there is no "code" in e.g. documentation | 17:43 |
| ya | ? | 17:43 |
| nathany | are you referring to GFDL or GPL licensed works? | 17:44 |
| nathany | ya: btw, where did that statement come from? | 17:44 |
| ya | i understand that the GFDL is incompatible with almost any opensource/opencontent licenses because of the "non-modifiable parts" element | 17:45 |
| nathany | i know we recommend not using CC licenses for software, but haven't seen anything worded quite that way | 17:45 |
| ya | but i'm not sure about the reason why CC-BY-SA is incompatible with the GPL | 17:45 |
| nathany | ya: exactly | 17:45 |
| ya | the statement comes from: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/license-list.html | 17:45 |
| nathany | ya: because the version of the license they're referring to requires that derivative works be released under *exactly* the same license | 17:46 |
| nathany | so anything combining BY-SA 2.0 and GPL (although i can't imagine why you'd do that) would have to be BY-SA 2.0 to comply with BY-SA, and would have to be GPL to comply with GPL | 17:46 |
| nathany | so that's an obvious incompatibility | 17:46 |
| nathany | the 3.0 license says "same or compatible license" but no license has been granted "compatibility" status | 17:47 |
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| ya | well in this case the GPL is simply incompatible with any copyleft license that require derivatives work to be released unedr "exactly" the same license? | 17:47 |
| nathany | IANAL but that sounds accurate | 17:48 |
| ya | since it itsel require them to be licensed under exactly the same license? | 17:48 |
| ya | IANAL? :) | 17:48 |
| ya | so it is nothing related to the mandatory attribution requirement? | 17:49 |
| nathany | ya: that's also a problem from the GPL side of thing | 17:50 |
| nathany | IANAL = "I am not a lawyer" | 17:50 |
| ya | ahah, ok :) | 17:50 |
| ya | so the attribution thing is fully compatible with the GPL, right ? | 17:51 |
| ya | it's just the stupid wording of the SA condition that creates the incompatibility? | 17:51 |
| nathany | no, i think the attribution is also incompatible, but you'd have to ask FSF for a "real" opinion | 17:51 |
| nathany | i probably wouldn't call the wording "stupid" ;) | 17:52 |
| nathany | note that the licenses have orthogonal targets -- | 17:52 |
| nathany | the GPL is a software license; what it means to GPL text is unclear | 17:52 |
| nathany | CC licenses are specifically NOT recommended for software | 17:52 |
| ya | well on Notwithstanding any other provision of this License, for material you add to a covered work, you may (if authorized by the copyright holders of that material) supplement the terms of this License with terms: b) Requiring preservation of specified reasonable legal notices or author attributions in that material or in the Appropriate Legal Notices displayed by works containing it; http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html, it says that: | 17:53 |
| nathany | interesting; is that 3.0? | 17:54 |
| nathany | ah, right, it is | 17:54 |
| ya | yup | 17:54 |
| nathany | i was referring to 2.0, I guess | 17:54 |
| nathany | (wrt attribution) | 17:55 |
| ya | so.. it may appear that GPL 3.0 and CC-BY-SA 3.0 are theoretically compatible, ye? | 17:55 |
| nathany | ya: theoretically, but they're not at this point | 17:56 |
| nathany | the SA 3.0 license clause states that they're compatible with those listed at http://creativecommons.org/compatiblelicenses | 17:57 |
| nathany | no license has been declared compatible yet; 3.0 just added the "hook" that lets us do that | 17:57 |
| ya | so we just have to wait perhaps :) | 17:57 |
| nathany | i think it's unlikely BY-SA 3.0 and GPL 3.0 will be declared compatible | 17:57 |
| ya | you think? why not? | 17:58 |
| nathany | because of the license target issue i mentioned previously | 17:58 |
| ya | oh okay | 17:58 |
| nkinkade | Varnish seems to be causing some problem with Magpie RSS, for what it's worth. | 17:58 |
| nathany | i don't think there's demand for compatibility between GPL 3.0 and BY-SA | 17:58 |
| nathany | GFDL and BY-SA, yes | 17:58 |
| Bovinity | nkinkade: colour me not surprised. | 17:59 |
| nathany | (because there's an overlap in the types of works each can be applied to) | 17:59 |
| nathany | note that that's just my personal opinion, not anything official | 17:59 |
| ya | sure :) | 17:59 |
| ya | well apparently there is something going on about the FSF and CC in order to let wiki be compatible with the CC | 18:00 |
| paulproteus | There's something strange goin' on tonight! | 18:00 |
| Bovinity | something strange in your neighbourhood? | 18:00 |
| nathany | ya: yes, that's been in the works for a while | 18:00 |
| paulproteus | There's something going on that's not quite right! | 18:00 |
| nathany | Bovinity: who ya gonna call? | 18:00 |
| ya | so i guess the gfdl & the cc-by-sa will be eventually compatible :) | 18:00 |
| ya | hopefully :) | 18:01 |
| paulproteus | I was thinking "Strange" by REM. | 18:01 |
| Bovinity | a small group of rogue ghost "busters" | 18:01 |
| paulproteus | But I'd also accept Ghostbusters. | 18:01 |
| Bovinity | a ragtag team of gentlemen with particle accelerators strapped to their backs | 18:01 |
| * paulproteus 's eyes widen. | 18:01 | |
| nathany | don't cross the beams! | 18:01 |
| paulproteus | ya, Yes - that's the GFDL and by-sa, not GPL and by-sa. | 18:03 |
| paulproteus | Just to be clear. | 18:04 |
| ya | yup | 18:04 |
| ya | btw, does the GFDL also allow for attribution to be given ? | 18:06 |
| Bovinity | ya: you may find this enlightening: | 18:10 |
| Bovinity | http://wiki.creativecommons.org/Version_3#BY-SA_.E2.80.94_Compatibility_Structure_Introduced | 18:10 |
| Bovinity | or, not | 18:10 |
| ya | ok nice | 18:14 |
| ya | thanks | 18:14 |
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| nkinkade | So it turns out that the problem with Magpie RSS was a bug in Varnish that according to the developer is fixed in trunk: | 18:30 |
| nkinkade | http://varnish.projects.linpro.no/ticket/197 | 18:30 |
| nkinkade | It took me about 1.5 hours to find this, sadly. And it took wading through a 500MB varnish log with less. Yikes. | 18:31 |
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| paulproteus | Bovinity, Got a sec? I broke something on search-dot and I don't see how it broke. | 18:34 |
| paulproteus | Namely: | 18:34 |
| paulproteus | Er, wait a min actually. | 18:34 |
| * Bovinity waits! | 18:34 | |
| paulproteus | http://search.creativecommons.org/?request=update&lang=en_US JS error | 18:34 |
| paulproteus | Jamendo went away? | 18:34 |
| paulproteus | Was Jamendo ever there? So confused. | 18:34 |
| Bovinity | jamneod shouldn't be there | 18:35 |
| Bovinity | the code is in the JS though... | 18:35 |
| paulproteus | Right, and that causes a JS error that prevents the frame from loading. | 18:35 |
| Bovinity | sweet | 18:35 |
| paulproteus | I'll remove it from the JS... | 18:35 |
| paulproteus | (list of engines to show by default) | 18:35 |
| Bovinity | yeah, kill it | 18:36 |
| paulproteus | Uh, phantoms in the brain. | 18:38 |
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| Bovinity | brain drain in the mainframe | 18:39 |
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| Bovinity | paulproteus: http://a5.creativecommons.org:8080/~alex/search/index.php | 18:53 |
| paulproteus | Yay! | 18:55 |
| paulproteus | Bovinity, Looks good to me; get Mike to say yes and then commit it. | 18:59 |
| paulproteus | (Or just commit it) | 18:59 |
| Bovinity | will commit after signoff | 18:59 |
| paulproteus | How sad that it's not a beautiful distributed rcs branch. | 18:59 |
| Bovinity | search is lightweight enough for git conversion, right? ;) | 19:00 |
| paulproteus | There are some svn:externals. | 19:01 |
| paulproteus | But nothing that git submodules couldn't also handle. | 19:01 |
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