Thursday, 2010-04-15

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Flannelgreg-g: That's alright, my server died and I fell off he internet for a week anyway.02:41
greg-gFlannel: oh yuck02:49
Flannelgreg-g: It's alright, I'm the proud owner of a brand new harddrive and UPS!02:50
Flannelgreg-g: "do what you like" would include selling, right?02:51
FlannelI can't imagine anyone would find a way to sell this, but I'd be impressed if they did.02:51
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greg-gFlannel: correct, selling included03:01
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ea4xgrany Python coder around? :)13:51
ea4xgrsee at
ea4xgrit reads "from paste.util.mimeparse import desired_matches" (in line 19)13:53
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ea4xgrand then we have "$ cat paste/util/ | grep -c desired_matches" which yields 013:54
ea4xgrhowever, "wget -q -O - | grep -c desired_matches" yields "2"13:56
ea4xgris this a bug of Paste 1.7.3 (wrong packaging)?13:57
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* ea4xgr notified the author via e-mail14:12
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* ea4xgr has fixed the installation of the validator (pushed)17:05
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ea4xgrnathany: hi! as far as the current version of the License Validator Service is concerned, ain't Pylons+Genshi a bit overkill?19:12
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nathanyea4xgr, perhaps; it doesn't feel all that heavy weight to me19:13
ea4xgrbasically, we have a static page (about), a form, and one action w/ three different input combinations (get uri, post textarea, post w/ file upload)19:13
nathanyyeah, it is pretty simple19:14
nathanyi guess it feels like we already have the pylons/genshi framework in place, not necessarily worth spending time ripping out, is it? i mean, pylons has seemed pretty easy to live with to me19:15
nathany(although i'm open to reasons to change)19:15
ea4xgrwell, I've (fixed the installation process and) installed validator.git today, eggs alone are 67.7 MB19:16
ea4xgrthough it feels more like a Web application for BaseHTTPServer :)19:17
ea4xgrthe serious dependencies (excluding cc.license*) are 1 MB in total (html5lib, pyRdfa, rdfadict, rdflib)19:19
nathanysure; if we were going to rip it out things out, we'd probably want to do something like we're doing with cc.engine -- a purse wsgi app19:19
nathany(as opposed to bashttpserver)19:19
ea4xgrI know that the original validator (your Web app) was pure cgi19:19
nathanyright, i'd like to avoid that model19:20
ea4xgrmay I ask what are the reasons for not pure cgi (for an app that simple like current validator)?19:20
ea4xgrwe do not have different language versions, we do not have different content types, we do not have multiple encodings19:21
nathanybasically the overhead of using a long-running process like a wsgi app are very low, and it gives us a middleware pipeline that is very flexible if we need to scale up in the future19:21
nathanyand if we do wsgi/fcgi, apache can handle all the process pooling, etc for us19:22
nathanyi don't think a simple WSGI app is any more complex than a CGI, and there are definite beneftis19:22
ea4xgrok, so as I understand it now, BaseHTTPServer is more like for proof-of-concept cowboy-coding purposes?19:22
ea4xgrand we can have a production-grade pure wsgi Web app?19:23
nathanyyeah; it also mixes things a bit -- your application is then tied to a specific HTTP server19:23
ea4xgryou're right19:23
nathanywhere as doing a wsgi app lets you write to an interface, plug it into different web servers as needed19:24
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ea4xgrincidentally, have you seen the GUI proposal (the blue one)?19:25
nathanyapparently not, since i'm not sure what that means19:25
ea4xgrI've attached the link to ui.tar.gz to the GSoC proposal19:26
ea4xgrit's an archive with a proposal of the layout for validator19:26
nathanyah, ok19:26
ea4xgrusing some animation etc.19:26
nathanyi'll take a look when i get a minute19:26
ea4xgrok, 'cause w/ layout it's never like w/ bugfixing or functionality enhancement - some like it, some do not19:27
nathanyright :)19:27 does not have animations, but there is some ECMAScript there viz. tabs (w/ graceful degradation)19:28
mralexi hope it's not ugly! if it's going to be a public facing thing. :)19:28
akozakmralex, comic sans19:28
akozakworks every time!19:29
mralexit's my kryptonite :(19:29
ea4xgrif anyone would like to comment, he/she's more than welcome19:30
akozakea4xgr, link doesn't work for me.19:30
ea4xgrmralex: definitely public facing19:30
ea4xgrakozak: have you removed "ABC"?19:30
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nathany-lunchea4xgr, i'm heading to lunch, will look at it afterwards19:32
ea4xgrnathany-lunch: thanks19:33
akozakhmm, "remote document" might be technically correct but maybe "web page" would be more friendly?19:34
ea4xgrakozak: as long as the validator will be able to extract license information from Web pages only (in the conventional sense), I see your point19:35
akozakmaybe URL19:35
ea4xgrconsider if we could extract from .ogg, EXIF, too (via liblicense)19:35
akozakoh right19:35 has  Validate by URI Validate by File Upload Validate by Direct Input19:36
akozakyea my thought was that "document" might be confusing19:36
akozakthen again maybe not for the target audience19:36
ea4xgron a side note, nat\hany has already proposed that 'license validation service' is not a good name, since we do not validate >licenses<19:37
akozakI'd move documentation to the footer. but I don't think it's particularly bad where it is.19:37
ea4xgrdo you mean the FAQ?19:37
akozakwhatever whatever "documentation" is19:37
akozakim jsut looking at the png19:37
akozakand I'm not a designer19:37
ea4xgrif so, yes - definitely to the footer or, even better, a separate page19:37
akozaksooo take it with a grain of salt19:37
mralexman, that's a fuck ton of reading before getting to the point19:38
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ea4xgrakozak: if you extract the contents of the archive, you can simply view the .html - it's a static Web page19:38
akozakah ok19:38
ea4xgrmralex: point noted. doc should go to a separate Web page19:38
akozakyea that top text might be worse than useless19:38
ea4xgrmralex: w/ JavaScript it's not shown at all19:38
mralexea4xgr: the js isn't active by default in this mockup?19:39
ea4xgrit should be19:39
ea4xgrw8, I've noticed it isn't :)19:40
ea4xgrI'm gonna fix that and publish as a temporary directory on my Web page to spare you the hassle19:41
ea4xgrbut if you already extracted, change is needed in the 7th line : combined.js to combined.source.js - then the JS works by default19:42
ea4xgr(in the 7th line of index.html)19:42
mralexproblem with the PACKed js?19:43
mralex(i recommend using minify over PACK, it's usually faster and less error-prone)19:43
ea4xgrthanks :)19:44
ea4xgrok, uploaded the fixed version:
mralexah, that's better ;)19:48
ea4xgrso JS (basically jquery w/ plugins) gives us rounded corners, animation, tabs19:49
ea4xgr"this field is required" and a custom image instead of the standard "choose file" button19:50
ea4xgroh, and we have extensible textarea (grab at the bottom)19:50
* ea4xgr has updated ui.tar.gz to fix the non-working JS19:54
akozakah ea4xgr, much better live :)19:55
ea4xgrthe docs is completely unofficial!!! a remake of a few answers from's FAQ19:55
ea4xgrmaybe it could use a tree collapse or something, if there would be a lot of questions19:56
ea4xgrakozak: :)19:56
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nathanyea4xgr, looks like a good start; i'd probably not do the collapse-expand animation when you switch "tabs", but overall looks a lot better20:08
ea4xgrnathany: noted. any other suggestions? ideas? as you said, it's just a start - that's why it's a static page20:10
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nathanyea4xgr, nope, that's it; we can work on wordsmithing the actual docs as we go forward20:12
ea4xgrno animation suggestion reminds me of a slashdot tag I read once, need to find that :)20:14
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ea4xgruh, can't find it; went something like transitioneffectisnotafeature :)20:24
akozakheh, i think slashdot hates everything that you can't view in emacs or whatever20:25
mralextransitions can be nice, if not excessivly over-done20:26
akozaknext thing you know they'll be railing against color gradients :P20:26
mralexyou can take my rounded corners from my cold dead  hands20:26
akozakyour cold, dead web 2.0 hands20:26
ea4xgrthank you for all the feedback; I hope to read more of it later20:28
akozaklooks like it's coming along nicely ea4xgr20:29
ea4xgrakozak: seems like any layout would be an advance over what is currently at
mralexgood lord20:31
mralexi must have forcibly forgotten about that20:32
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akozakpssht, at least it's lynx compatible20:32
akozakwhoa, it is20:33
akozakworks quite nicely in console20:33
mralexyou doubted it?20:34
akozakI guess I shouldn't have.20:34
ea4xgrLOL, graceful degradation for the win20:35
ea4xgrthe latest eLinks supports ECMAScript to some extent20:35
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akozaknathany, could you give me admin on acawiki?21:13
akozakusername akozak21:13
akozaknathany, err sorry maybe I don't need it.21:17
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nkinkadeakozak: Maps on wiki?  I dropped the ball yesterday.21:52
akozaknkinkade, that's ok.22:07
nkinkadeakozak: So where do you think the problem is?22:07
nkinkadeHow can I start troubleshooting.22:08
nkinkadeI don't know anything about embedding maps.22:08
akozaknkinkade, my guess is that the api key is missing or not working.22:08
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nkinkadeWhere is a page where a map is supposed to display?22:08
akozaknkinkade, hmm, let me create one22:08
nkinkadeakozak: By the way, are you thinking about using Google Maps?22:10
akozaknkinkade, wasn't sure yet. I was going to compare the options.22:10
nkinkadeI seem to recall a week or two ago discussing this with you here, and Asheesh chimed in.22:10
akozak and
akozakboth allow for more than Google22:11
nkinkadeakozak: Both of those extensions are installed.22:11
akozaklooks to be an API key problem22:13
nkinkadeakozak: I'm already there, but I see no documentation about to actually use the extension.22:15
akozaknkinkade, there are some demos at
akozaknkinkade, and Semantic Maps enables maps in SMW inline queries22:16
akozakI used the top example on my Mpas userpage linked above22:16
nkinkadeakozak: Try it now.22:18
nkinkadeIt would appear that by default it tries to use Google Maps.  I had to specify the service on the page you linked to above.22:18
akozaknkinkade, that doesn't quite solve the problem though, since we need the #geocode feature22:20
akozakand that requires either a Google or Yahoo API key22:20
nkinkadeakozak: So you're saying that we have to use Google or Yahoo!?22:20
akozaknkinkade, possibly. Let me double check.22:20
nkinkadeIt would be nice to keep proprietary maps off the CC wiki.22:20
nkinkade(even if they are free)22:21
nkinkadeIt's possible that Mike would object, so you may want to run it by him if Google or Yahoo! are the only options for what you want to do.22:21
akozaknkinkade, let me see if you can use openstreetmaps without needing coordinates22:22
nkinkadeOr OpenLayers.22:22
akozakerr right22:22
akozaknkinkade, yea I don't think you can map anything that isn't a coordinate.22:31
akozakyou don't need to use Google Maps per se, just their geocoding service22:31
akozakso we can convert location information into coordinates22:31
nkinkadeakozak: So this means we have to install the GoogleGeocoder extension too?22:34
akozaknkinkade, no I think that's been included into the Maps extension.22:35
akozakit was merged with Maps I think.22:35
nkinkadeThe docs say "$egGoogleMapsKey" ...22:35
nkinkadeIt's not actually $wg?22:35
akozakheh, good question22:36
nkinkadeakozak: I added a Google Maps API to LocalSettings.php22:36
nkinkadeakozak: Didn't I just add a Google Maps API key to something recently?22:37
nkinkadeLike in the past 2 weeks?22:37
akozaknkinkade, I seem to remember that, but I don't remember what it was.22:37
akozakit was for someone besides me :)22:37
nkinkadeBut I remember you saying something about it.  Let me find that key.22:38
nathanynkinkade, you added it to civi for me22:40
nkinkadenathany: Thanks. :-)22:40
akozaknkinkade, doesn't appear to be working, but it might just take time.22:45
akozakI'll start a data repair job22:45
nkinkadeakozak: Try again.  I just entered what I believe to be a valid API key.22:45
akozakah excellent22:45
nkinkadeakozak: I see a map on your sample page.22:49
nkinkadeSadly it's a Google Map.22:49
akozaknkinkade, testing the API key22:49
akozakbecause geocode doesn't appear to be working22:50
nkinkadeWell, at least the API key seems to work. :-)22:50
nkinkadeBut again, if for some reason there are proprietary maps in use, run it by Mike.22:50
akozaknkinkade, yes I plan on using open maps, but I need to get the Google geocoder to work first22:50
nkinkadeJust making sure ...22:51
mralexakozak: if you want to be really cool, use the reverse geocoder22:51
nkinkadeakozak: Yeah, I just saw that in LocalSettings.php and was about to write here.22:52
nkinkadeOoops.  I meant mralex.22:52
nkinkade$egMapsDefaultGeoService = 'geonames';22:52
nkinkadeThat is in LocalSettings.php, and may be affecting you, akozak.22:52
akozaknkinkade, that would make sense.22:53
akozaknkinkade, is there some geonames api key that needs to be updated or something?22:54
mralexshouldn't be, they don't use api keys22:55
akozakI'm having an awful time finding documentation for maps and semantic maps.22:56
nkinkadeakozak: It doesn't appear that Geonames needs a key.  Yeah, I couldn't find much at all about Maps extension.22:56
akozaknkinkade, "All settings are located in Maps_Settings.php, in the root of the extension."22:57
akozakis that true or is it outdated?22:57
nkinkadeI have no idea, but egMapsDefaultGeoService is set in LocalSettings.22:58
akozaknkinkade, efGoogleMapsKey isn't set in Maps_Settings.php22:59
nkinkadeakozak: But it is in LocalSettings.23:00
akozaknkinkade, could Maps_Settings be overridding it?23:00
akozakit's set to ''23:00
nkinkadeI wouldn't expect that we'd have to edit a file in the extension itself.23:00
nkinkadeI'm guessing that LocalSettings will override whatever is in the Maps_Settings.23:01
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akozaknkinkade, true. Is it set after the extension is included>23:01
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akozaknkinkade, I've gotta run to the post office23:04
akozakbe back in a few23:04
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greg-gakozak: taxes? :)23:11
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akozakgreg-g, no, grant financials :)23:21
akozakI did my taxes in Feb23:21
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akozaknkinkade, looks like geocoding is working now23:21
nkinkadeWeird.  I didn't do anything.23:22
akozakmight just be slow23:22
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