Tuesday, 2009-10-20

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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay00:55
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jibotBovinity is brilliant and aware of Basement Cat, and iz not afraid.01:19
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay03:35
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay03:48
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jibotJoiIto is blogging at http://joi.ito.com/ and the CEO of Creative Commons and an all round good egg10:46
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jibotJoiIto is blogging at http://joi.ito.com/ and the CEO of Creative Commons and an all round good egg13:37
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jibotBovinity is brilliant and aware of Basement Cat, and iz not afraid.15:51
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nathanynkinkade, did you already add lithuanian to ccsearch on pootle?16:48
nkinkadenathany: I did, but I think I did it wrong.16:48
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nkinkadeI was waiting for you to show up in here so that I could verify.16:48
nkinkadeI added it via the Pootle admin interface, but that seemed wrong immediately after doing it.16:49
nathanynkinkade, one second, looking16:49
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nathanynkinkade, i'm not sure it's inherently wrong, but it does look like the template PO files haven't been updated...16:50
nathanylet me take a look at that16:50
nkinkadenathany: I went to Admin -> Projects -> ccsearch, then selected Lithuanian from the dropdown at the bottom of the page and clicked "Add language"16:50
nathanythat should work if the POT template is up to date (at least for ccsearch)16:50
nathanynkinkade, i just updated the POT template16:56
nathanyi think you should be able to either do "update" in lithuanian or recreate it16:56
nkinkadenathany: What's the process for that? bin/sync?16:56
nkinkadeI couldn't find a way to remove a language from a project in Pootle, so hopefully update works.16:57
nathanyfor updating?16:57
nkinkadeYeah, for updating a POT file.16:57
nathanyi thought there was an "update" in the web interface16:57
nathanyam I a global admin?16:57
nathanynkinkade, nevermind16:58
nathanylooks like it picked it up on its own16:58
nkinkadenathany: I ran the update in the web interface.16:58
nathanylooks like it worked :)16:58
nathanyyou want to reply to that email?16:59
nkinkadeAdmin -> Projects -> ccsearch ... then check Lithuanian and click "Update languages"16:59
nkinkadeIs that option not in your interface?16:59
nkinkadeI'll reply to the email.16:59
nathanyWhere is this mythical "Admin" link you speak of? ;)16:59
nkinkadeIn the header once you are logged in.16:59
nkinkadeMaybe you're not a site admin?17:00
nathanynope, not there for me17:00
nkinkadenathany: I think making someone a site admin is a matter of manipulating the sqlite database.17:01
nkinkadeI'll enable your account now.17:01
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jibotakozak is Alex Kozak, Program Assistant at ccLearn and SFC@Berkeley co-founder and a norse god17:02
nkinkadenathany: See if the Admin link is there for you now.17:07
nkinkadeMaybe you'll have to log out and back in, or maybe I'll even have to restart Pootle.17:07
nathanynkinkade, i tried to log out and now http://translate.creativecommons.org/ seems to be a directory listing17:08
nathanyit's back17:08
nathanyof course, logging out seems broken17:08
nkinkadeLogout works okay for me, though I have seen the behavior you are talking about.17:08
nkinkadeSometimes it feels like Pootle is pure match sticks and chewing gum.17:09
nkinkadeI haven't encountered such a poorly conceived user interface in a long time.17:09
nathanynkinkade, trying to log in, i get a 40417:09
nathanyfor http://translate.creativecommons.org/login.html17:09
nathanynevermind, i have more important things to deal with17:10
nathany(ie, anything at all)17:10
nathanyhopefully we can clear some time soon to look @ transifex17:10
paroneayeanathany: http://dpaste.com/109818/17:21
paroneayeaso old license system had a .rdf() method that spit that out17:21
paroneayeashould I add a rdf() method that does the same to cc.license?17:21
nathanyparoneayea, yeah, we should be able to get the RDF-XML out for a license...17:23
nathanywe should also add an HTML comment above that one that says "this is deprecated and dumb. use the RDFa."17:23
nathany(well, perhaps the language could use some finesse ;) )17:23
paroneayeaheh :)17:23
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay17:46
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JED3nkinkade: ping18:14
nkinkadeJED3: Hi.18:14
JED3hey, trying to get to the bottom of these missing CC Network invites18:15
JED3can you tell me when a contribution in civi that is marked as complete *not* have a receipt_date associated with it?18:16
JED3^ nkinkade18:18
nkinkadeJED3: When someone enters the contribution manually, for example.18:18
nkinkadeSometimes Allison and Melissa enter contributions manually because they receive a check, or because it's something internal.18:19
nkinkadeIt also happened for around 90 people when we first launched because the new method didn't have the ability to send receipts.18:19
nkinkadeIt does now, and in fact not 5 minutes a I ran a new script to  send receipts to the 90 people who hadn't received them and updated the database.18:20
nkinkadeJED3: All that aside, receipt_date is probably not the field to use.18:20
nkinkadeWhether they got mailed a receipt shouldn't be a requisite for membership in the CC Network.18:21
nkinkade(or the criteria that determines it)18:21
nkinkadeBetter to simply make sure the contribution_status_id is 1 and then use the receive_date for dating purposes.18:21
nkinkadeJED3: ^^18:21
JED3yeah, the reasoning behind using receipt_date was to only fetch the contributions that completed for the day18:24
JED3i realize thats its not optimal but the easiest available attribute I could base that logic on18:24
JED3plus, its always been reliant on that field, so I figured that itd be safe to leave it that way18:25
JED3nkinkade: these contributions without receipt_dates are from paypal transactions18:25
JED3only it only happened the 5th through the 7th18:26
nkinkadeJED3:  Not necessarily.18:26
nkinkadeJED3: I think receive_date is a better field and should always have a value.18:26
JED3so receive_date + contribution_status_id = 1 will work just fine?18:28
mralexnkinkade: was there any conclusion to the receipt= discussion for donations/oneclick, or did that go on-hold until i got back?18:30
nkinkademralex: I changed the links on /donate, but didn't do anything for the "Choose your own amount" box, or for PCPs, etc.18:35
nkinkadeI created a ticket and assigned it to you a week or so ago ... those should be easy to fix, right?18:35
mralexnkinkade: right18:35
nkinkadeJED3: I think receive_date + contribution_status_id = 1 will be fine.18:36
mralexnkinkade: did you go with different receipt ids for different levels?18:36
nkinkademralex: No ... just using receipt ID 20.  Melissa never replied to the email.18:36
nkinkadeThe option is there should she want to do it.18:36
mralexnkinkade: ok18:37
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johndbrittonim curious about using an image under CC-BY-SA. I'm going to create a work under CC-BY-NC-SA and would like to include the image. I'm wondering if the image being reproduced exactly constitutes a derivative work.18:49
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greg-gjohndbritton: if you are just including the image in a collection, not modifying the image, then you don't need to license the entire work as BY-SA (ie: you can have it as BY-NC-SA). The individual images are still available under their original licenses, but the work as a whole is BY-NC-SA19:47
johndbrittongreg-g: I'm wondering specifically about the text surrounding the image, we're going to be using maps from open street maps19:47
greg-gjohndbritton: I'm not exactly sure what you mean by the text surrounding the time19:48
greg-germ, image, not time19:48
johndbrittonwe're developing a textbook on GIS and want to use images from OSM19:48
johndbrittonso it is likely that the text will reference the images19:49
johndbrittonbut the images could be swapped for other maps, say for example we had two maps of boston19:49
johndbrittoneither would work, and we're not getting the fact that boston is on the water from OSM... it's a known fact that OSM illustrates19:49
greg-goh, if you are just referencing the images in the text, that is totally fine. As long as you aren't changing the actual image you don't need to worry19:50
johndbrittonso we just have to make it known that the images are CC-BY-SA19:50
johndbrittonbut our book can be CC-BY-NC-SA19:50
johndbrittonThanks greg-g19:52
greg-gsuggested citation "Source: OpenStreetMap (url to image/OSM) Available under a CC BY-SA license, http://creativecommons/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"19:52
greg-gjohndbritton: no prob19:52
johndbrittonwe're you at Open Ed Conf?19:53
greg-gjohndbritton: I was not, but I work with Open.Michigan, which had a few people at the conference (Ted Hanss, Garin Fons, Piet Kleymeer, Chuck Severance)19:55
johndbrittonYeah, I met Garin at Open Everything in NYC and again out in Vancouver19:55
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greg-gah yeah, we're doing an event on the 30th here in Ann Arbor, are you doing one in NYC (are you from there or somewhere else?)19:58
johndbrittonI organized Open Everything in HK last December and in NYC over the summer. I was planning to organize an event in SF that weekend, but I haven't been able to find a location20:00
akozakjohndbritton: nice to hear from you again :)20:12
johndbrittonoh hey there alex20:14
paroneayeanathany: looks like license.current_version used to return the actual object of the current license20:14
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jibotJoiIto is blogging at http://joi.ito.com/ and the CEO of Creative Commons and an all round good egg20:14
paroneayeawhereas currently it just returns '3.0'20:14
paroneayeaor, whatever20:14
akozakjohndbritton: how's the consulting going?20:14
paroneayeado we want something similar to teh old functionality, in maybe another attribute name20:14
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nathanyparoneayea, ok; i don't remember where that's used20:14
nathany(the old functionality)20:14
nathanyoh, to determine if its been superseded?20:15
johndbrittongoing well, don't have too much time for it with the full time at FWK though20:15
paroneayeanot to determine, as that's a separate attribute, .superseded20:15
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paroneayeabut, for example, in the templates:20:15
paroneayea               tal:content="license/current_version/uri"20:16
paroneayeaI could construct the current_version in the view pretty easily20:16
paroneayeabut I just wanted to see if you'd prefer it to be a License method/attribute20:16
nathanyso right now there's a .current_version on the new License object that just returns the version number?20:17
nathanyis that actually used anywhere?20:17
nathany(i'd assume cc.license would be the place it's used, if anywhere)20:17
nathanyanyway, that seems like a not-that-useful attribute (just the version number)20:18
paroneayeayeah, that's what I was thinking20:18
nathanyso i'd say let's:20:18
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nathanya) replace it with a version that returns a License object20:18
nathanyb) run the test suite20:18
nathanyc) add a new test that asserts it's returning a License object so we can make sure we don't change it in the future without thinking abou tit20:18
paroneayeanathany: ok, sounds good, thx20:19
nathanyparoneayea, does that make sense to you?20:19
paroneayeayep :)20:19
paroneayeaand, obviously I already counted my chickens before they hatched late last week but20:20
paroneayeaI thiiiiink that's the last attribute to update to get the deeds to render20:20
paroneayeabut, counting unhatched chickens again I guess :x20:20
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mralexnkinkade: should the CC Network join buttons on support.creativecommons.org/join/ also include the receipt querystring? (I'm guessing yes)20:53
JED3non-Apress publication of DIP20:54
nkinkademralex: I think you're probably right, but we should check with nathany20:54
nkinkadenathany created a special template for CC Network, but maybe it's only working for /a/renew?20:55
nathanymralex, ^^20:55
* mralex nods20:55
nathanymralex, i was also meaning to ask you if you had an SVG version of the acawiki header graphic20:55
nathanytrying to get pieces in place to wrap up some bugs/revs there20:55
mralexnathany: i think so. you pinged me about that ebfore, right? i'll look into it.20:55
nathanymralex, yes, i sent an email but it was pre-campaign launch so i assumed it got buried20:56
mralexnathany: sent21:10
nathanythanks, mralex21:10
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jibotJoiIto is blogging at http://joi.ito.com/ and the CEO of Creative Commons and an all round good egg21:20
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jibotjgay is http://www.gnu.org/people/speakers.html#Gay21:38
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lotiaubuntu.com is down!21:45
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nkinkademralex: What is done-cbb status for issues?22:04
nkinkadeakozak: Do you have any idea why a6 might be pushing huge amounts of data to a7?22:08
paroneayeaif I try running sparql queries that do something like22:09
paroneayea?license rdf:type cc:License .22:10
paroneayea?license cc:identifier 'by'22:10
paroneayeaor, whatever22:10
paroneayeait seems to take several minutes22:10
paroneayeaas opposed to if I do the second filtering by hand22:11
paroneayeanot sure why that is.22:11
mralexnkinkade: "could be better"? I dunno what the "cbb" is. Done seemed better than Resolved for this.22:13
nkinkademralex: Yeah, it seems that you're right.  I'm going to change it to resolved, I think, if you don't mind.22:14
nkinkadeYou've done everything we needed for that ticket.22:15
nathanynkinkade, is it a6 that's responsible for that overage?22:17
nathany(traffic between a6 and a7, that is)22:17
nkinkadenathany: I'm not sure, but I was poking around.22:17
nathanyi did clone our MW repository a couple times, @ about 3G each, over the past few days22:18
nathanydon't know if that's it...?22:18
nkinkadenathany: For the past 5 or 10 minutes there is data going from a6 to a7 that fluctuates from between 1Mb/sec to 10Mb/sec.22:18
nkinkadeThere are some stats scripts running on a6 right now ... don't know if they are cause traffic??22:19
nkinkadepaulproteus' scripts22:19
nathany*maybe*... but that would be a little weird22:19
nkinkadenathany: Could it have anything at all to do with discoverEd?22:20
nkinkadeJust checking.22:20
nathanythat's what i was trying to think about22:20
akozaknkinkade: no idea22:20
akozaknot running a crawl or anything22:20
nkinkadeakozak: Cool ... just checking to see if you were doing something you thought might cause that.22:20
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paroneayeanathany: you there?22:48
paroneayeajust curious if you might know why that second query is so much slower22:49
paroneayeawhen it's only adding a query on its rdf:type22:49
nathanyparoneayea, yeah, let me look22:49
nathanyparoneayea, i don't know off the top of my head22:50
nathanyi wonder if there's something that's causing it to run both queries independently and then union them22:50
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nathanyi forget if the sparql primer has any guidance on this22:51
nathanyer, not union... disjunction? i forget22:52
paroneayeawell, I know what you mean22:52
paroneayeayeah I dunno.  even running both queries independently22:53
paroneayeatakes only a segment of the time22:53
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nkinkadenathany: Looks like the traffic from a6 -> a7 is a fucked up mixture of ProxyPass and msnbot.23:08
nathanywhat were we trying to maintain?23:08
nkinkadeAsheesh has some crazy rules in the apache config for labs.23:09
paulproteusMine shouldn't cause much traffic.23:09
nathanyor is our proxypass configuration just wrong?23:09
nkinkadepaulproteus: What's up with that stuff?23:09
paulproteusMy crawling scripts.23:09
paulproteusThey just do about 20K web requests every day.23:09
nathanyoh, right, we moved labs but didn't want to muck with moving the demos? (maybe?)23:09
paulproteusThat should be ca. 10MB of traffic.23:09
nathanypaulproteus, we've moved on from that23:09
* paulproteus nods, okay23:09
nkinkademsbot is asking a7 for URLs like: GET /~paulproteus/entrans/list.php?category=all&flt=3&flt=2&flt=4&edit_all=yes&flt=3&flt=1&flt=2&flt=1&page=2&flt=2&flt=2&flt=2 HTTP/1.1\r\n23:09
* paulproteus blinks.23:09
paulproteusentrans - isn't that an alternative to Pootle etc.23:10
nkinkadeWhich are getting proxied to a6.23:10
paulproteusI think it's what laconi.ca used to use.23:10
paulproteusWe don't need it; I was experimenting with it.23:10
nkinkadeAnd msn bot is asking for URLs like that again and again.23:10
nkinkadeIt's the only thing I can find that could account for anywhere from 500Kb/sec to 10Mb/sec of transfer from a6 -> a7 for at least the past hour.23:11
nathanynkinkade, is the bandwidth overage on a6 or a7?23:11
nkinkadenathany: on a723:11
nathanyalso, is there anything we actually care about on ~paulproteus on there?23:11
nkinkadeOn a7 ~paulproteus doesn't exists, but just gets proxied to a6.23:11
nathanyoh jesus23:12
nathanythat's sounding familiar now23:12
nkinkadeThe fact that msbot is hitting that stuff must mean the URL is published somewhere.23:12
nkinkadeLikely on labs.23:12
nathanycan we start blocking msnbot in the short term?23:12
nathanys/start/start by/23:12
nkinkadeThe first thing we should do is just disable the proxy rule.23:12
nathanyi'm trying to remember why we put it in place in the first place23:13
nkinkadepaulproteus: Is there any reason that this rule still needs to be in place on a7:23:13
nathanyi wonder if we're using labs.cc.org as the hostname for stats dumps?23:14
paulproteusYou should make those URLs 404 or something.23:14
nkinkadepaulproteus: Cool.  Thanks.23:14
nkinkadeFor now I'm going to remove those proxy configs for labs on a7.23:14
nathanyi'm guessing we're using labs/~paulproteus/eggs for something23:15
nathanyi wonder about labs/~paulprotues/stats23:15
nathanythe former we should just change the reference in our builduot23:15
nathanythe latter... hrm23:16
nkinkadenathany: I'm a bit lost regarding what you just wrote.23:17
nathanynkinkade, i was looking @ what's in paulproteus's public_html23:18
nkinkadeThough commenting out the proxypass rule for labs on a7 just cut all the traffic between a6 and a7.23:18
nathanystats are in there, and that strikes me as the one thing we may have put the proxy_pass in place to support http://labs.creativecommons.org/~paulproteus/stats/23:18
nathanyafter we moved stats from a7 to a623:18
nathanypaulproteus, does this ring a bell?23:18
nkinkadenathany: Yeah: http://wiki.creativecommons.org/License_statistics#Raw_search_engine_query_data23:20
nathanygot it23:20
nathanyi don't think i'm able to think straight about this at the moment23:20
nkinkadeThere are references to ~paulproteus/* all in there.23:20
nathanyi *think* we should probably... ugh23:21
nathanynot sure23:21
nkinkadenathany: I'm not either, as it's getting on to 7:30PM here.23:21
nathanymaybe just clearing out things like entrans and putting the proxypass back in place is enough?23:21
nathanynkinkade, can you make yourself a note to ping me about this tomorrow when we're both rested?23:21
nkinkadeBut I'll think of some temporary solution like maybe just a temporary robots.txt file23:21
nathanyfeel free to leave the proxypass disabled for the time being, and/or do the robots.txt23:22
nathanywe'll revisit tomorrow23:22
nkinkadenathany: Cool.23:22
nkinkadeI'll send us both a note to follow up on this tomorrow.23:22
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paulproteuscan't talk right now, will talk more around 823:24
paulproteus(pm my time)23:24
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