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| mtu | heyas - this may be a common question, but i didn't find an FAQ entry: | 13:56 |
|---|---|---|
| mtu | does it even make sense to use an NC license without SA? i'm thinking that someone might make a simple derivative work, release that himself and use it commercially | 13:57 |
| mtu | that is to say: does an NC license need the SA to be effective? | 13:57 |
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| mlinksva | mtu: no | 14:01 |
| mlinksva | licensee doesn't have to license work derived from by-nc under same license, but they still have to abide by terms -- can't use commercially | 14:02 |
| mtu | hmm. suppose they released the derivative work under the GFDL or something and a third person came along to use _that_ commercially. how is that prevented? | 14:03 |
| mlinksva | mtu: they couldn't release deriv under gfdl or one of the non-NC cc licenses | 14:07 |
| mlinksva | because doing so would grant more permissions than they have to grant | 14:07 |
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| mlinksva | (they don't have commercial permissions to grant, and fdl and the free CC licenses do grant commercial permissions) | 14:07 |
| mtu | i see! so NC kind of "implies" SA, at least by its restrictions | 14:07 |
| mlinksva | that's a needlessly confusing way of thinking about it | 14:08 |
| mlinksva | you always have to abide by the terms of whatever license you're using a work under (modulo fair use) | 14:09 |
| mlinksva | so for an NC work, you can't make commercial use | 14:09 |
| mlinksva | that's separate from SA, which says you have to distribute under the same license | 14:09 |
| mtu | okay, what i wanted was to be sure that NC would be effective | 14:11 |
| mtu | thanks a lot :) | 14:11 |
| mlinksva | i guess you could say NC is like a half-assed (sorry) SA in that it severly restricts the downstream user's licensing choices, but otoh it doesn't mandate that they distribute under a public license at all. NC just restricts a class of uses, and the licensing restrictions fall out of that | 14:11 |
| mlinksva | mtu: glad to help, but note I'm not a lawyer :) | 14:11 |
| mtu | be glad, i think it's not easy ;-) | 14:13 |
| mtu | all right, so thanks again and seeyas! | 14:13 |
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| haoyu | hi nathany | 15:56 |
| JanisB | hello, i am about GSoC - is RDF plugin for WP "job" already taken? | 15:57 |
| nathany | hi haoyu | 15:57 |
| nkinkade | is this the same haoyu with monitor.(cc).org? | 15:57 |
| nathany | JanisB: no decisions have been made... i can look and see if anyone has submitted a proposal | 15:58 |
| haoyu | yes it is :) | 15:58 |
| nathany | (of course, that wouldn't stop you from submitting one as well) | 15:58 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: I'm installing the Flash extension now. | 15:59 |
| JanisB | where I can submit proposal? | 15:59 |
| nathany | JanisB: i don't see one in the queue | 15:59 |
| nathany | http://socghop.appspot.com/ | 15:59 |
| haoyu | oh nkinkade, sorry I think I'm a bit confused, I was think nathany is you :p | 16:00 |
| nathany | i'm not :) | 16:00 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, thanks! :) | 16:01 |
| haoyu | nathany, yep :) | 16:01 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: we are both Nathan, but different last names. :-) | 16:01 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, got it :) | 16:01 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, I think the monitor.(cc).org site is up, but just the wiki can't be accessed. Maybe it is the mediawiki app is broken? | 16:04 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: I seem to be able to access the site file ... how do you mean the wiki? | 16:05 |
| nkinkade | *fine | 16:05 |
| nkinkade | Editing, etc? | 16:05 |
| haoyu | That's strange, any page inside "http://monitor.creativecommons.org/" is can't access from me | 16:06 |
| haoyu | maybe I'm blocked?? | 16:07 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/Austria | 16:07 |
| nkinkade | You can't see that page? Do you get an error of some sort or just a blank page? | 16:08 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, yes I can't see, and there's no error, it is just loading... | 16:08 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, i'm using firefox | 16:08 |
| haoyu | but I can access this: http://a7.creativecommons.org/apache2-default/ | 16:09 |
| haoyu | and when I ping monitor.(cc).org it do has response | 16:09 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: Try http://monitor.creativecommons.org:8080/Austria | 16:10 |
| nkinkade | That bypasses the HTTP accelerator. | 16:10 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, I can access http://monitor.creativecommons.org/Austria by wget | 16:11 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, but just can't access it from firefox.. | 16:11 |
| haoyu | also can't access http://monitor.creativecommons.org:8080/Austria from firefox | 16:11 |
| ankitg | haoyu: it works fine for me (using firefox) | 16:11 |
| nathany | works fine for me, too (Fx 3.1b3) | 16:12 |
| haoyu | must be some problem of my firefox | 16:12 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: Hmm. Not sure what to say ... do you have any funny proxy setup in Firefox? | 16:12 |
| ankitg | I see "by 281,840 35.76% " ect on the Argentina page | 16:12 |
| ankitg | *etc | 16:12 |
| haoyu | ankitg, yes that's you'd expected to see | 16:13 |
| ankitg | haoyu: yep, so as I said, it seems to be working fine in firefox at my end | 16:13 |
| ankitg | haoyu: side-tracking a bit, have you looked into visualizations yet? I'll have some time at the end of the week and could help a bit there if you haven't got to that part yet. =) | 16:15 |
| JanisB | nkinkade, about RDF plugin - is somewhere examples, how final product should looks like?... | 16:16 |
| nkinkade | JanisB: I think maybe you are looking for nathany. | 16:16 |
| nathany | JanisB: you mean RDFa in WP? | 16:17 |
| JanisB | ops, sry :> | 16:17 |
| JanisB | nathany, yes | 16:17 |
| haoyu | ankitg, I haven't do that yet. I just have tried to figure out how to do it | 16:17 |
| nathany | JanisB: you mean examples of how the XHTML should look? | 16:17 |
| nathany | that'd depend entirely on what metadata an author included | 16:17 |
| nathany | we haven't done any mockups of the visual editor, etc... it's pretty open ended | 16:18 |
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| JanisB | nathany, so RDF should be generated automatically for each new blog post? | 16:19 |
| ankitg | haoyu: okie, get your wiki viewing problem solved first. If you're still just starting out by Friday evening, We could look at it together or distribute the workload ... | 16:19 |
| haoyu | ankitg, that would be great, thanks! :) | 16:19 |
| nathany | JanisB: it should provide an interface which allows authors to add RDFa to their posts | 16:19 |
| nathany | supporting a few core vocabularies by default (dublin core, etc) | 16:20 |
| nathany | but allowing users to specify any predicate they wish to insert | 16:20 |
| JanisB | but all this metadata will be added by authors not by AI of plugin, correct? | 16:20 |
| nathany | JanisB: the RDFa primer may be userful (http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-rdfa-primer/) | 16:20 |
| nathany | JanisB: yes | 16:20 |
| Steren | JanisB, nathany : Hi, if you want to inspire you fromSemanticMediaWiki, there is the HAlo extension to add semantic data into text : http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Halo_Extension | 16:20 |
| JanisB | thanks god :) | 16:20 |
| Steren | JanisB, nathany : fot the HALO extension of SemanticMediaWiki, I suggest you just to watch the demo : http://www.ontoprise.de/smwdemo/ | 16:26 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, could you see the logs at server side and help to figure out why I'm blocked ( It seems the site blocked just my firefox browser..) | 16:26 |
| haoyu | also, could you try to access this and see what happen: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/File:Cc.png | 16:26 |
| JanisB | Steren, i'll see it, thank you | 16:26 |
| haoyu | I got an "Database error" | 16:26 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: Let me check the logs. | 16:29 |
| JanisB | by the way, i got an error too: MySQL returned error "1205: Lock wait timeout exceeded; try restarting transaction (localhost)". | 16:29 |
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| haoyu | nkinkade, My ip is 58.207.164.20, FYI | 16:29 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: Try to access this page again: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/Austria | 16:30 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, opening the link in firefox now | 16:31 |
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| nkinkade | haoyu: Interestingly I see your request with tcpdump, but not in the Apache logs for that site. | 16:34 |
| nkinkade | The conversations seems to have been cut short. | 16:34 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: Can you try to access a few more pages and to refresh, etc. | 16:35 |
| nkinkade | I'm going to capture the tcpdump output in a file and look at it with wireshark ... in the terminal it's mostly unprintable characters so I can't really see what's going on. | 16:35 |
| haoyu | okey | 16:36 |
| nkinkade | You tried to fetch File:CC.png, /Austria and recent changes, correct? | 16:37 |
| haoyu | I'm accessing the 'Hong_Kong' and Austria | 16:37 |
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| haoyu | I think File:cc.png and recent changes is several minutes ago | 16:38 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: I can send you the capture file if you want. It would appear that you connect, request a page, a7 acks your request and then nothing comes back from you. | 16:41 |
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| nkinkade | haoyu: Do you have SSH to some remote server? | 16:42 |
| nkinkade | (SSH access, I mean) | 16:43 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, yes I have, but then? | 16:43 |
| nkinkade | If so, you might try something like: | 16:43 |
| haoyu | that's really strange... | 16:43 |
| nkinkade | $ ssh -N -L 8888:monitor.creativecommons.org:80 <remote host> | 16:44 |
| nkinkade | Then in Firefox try to access http://localhost:8888/Austria | 16:44 |
| nkinkade | I'm curious if there is something broken about your ISP or some proxy they are using or the NAT, etc. | 16:45 |
| nkinkade | This other way will tunnel the request through SSH, which should bypass your current provider for the request. | 16:46 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, yes, but the problem is, I can access it at my local side using IE, and wget | 16:46 |
| haoyu | but just can't work on Firefox.. | 16:46 |
| ankitg | maybe it's a firefox extension that's gone haywire ... | 16:47 |
| nathany | nkinkade: does this look correct to you? | 16:48 |
| nathany | http://creativecommons.org/license/results-one?q_1=2&q_1=1&field_commercial=yes&field_derivatives=yes&field_jurisdiction=es&field_format=&field_worktitle=&field_attribute_to_name=&field_attribute_to_url=&field_sourceurl=&field_morepermissionsurl=&lang=es&language=es&n_questions=3 | 16:48 |
| haoyu | yeah... | 16:48 |
| nkinkade | nathany: Yeah, that looks good ... at least in term so that issue with "License" | 16:49 |
| nathany | right | 16:49 |
| nkinkade | The first part reads correctly. | 16:49 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, seems it is caused by upgrading of my system (or firefox), let me see if it can be fixed by just restart firefox.. | 16:49 |
| nathany | when you regenerated licenselocale.xsl it picked up your change | 16:50 |
| nkinkade | nathany: I'm not even sure what licenselocale.xsl does. :-) | 16:50 |
| nathany | i'm going to go ahead and close the issue (I don't see it in as conclusive a way with any other locale) | 16:50 |
| nathany | nkinkade: it contains all the generated localizations for license selections | 16:50 |
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| haoyu | nkinkade, it would be my firefox broken (strange, but I can use that firefox access other sites meanwhile) | 16:51 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, sorry to waste you a lot of time! | 16:51 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: No problem. You may have seen the email, but the Flash extension is installed and you should be able to upload *.xml files now. | 16:52 |
| haoyu | thanks nkinkade !!! :) | 16:54 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: My pleasure ... thank you for helping to organize the monitor site! | 16:55 |
| haoyu | oh, but I think there's still problem for this: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/File:Cc.png | 16:57 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: yeah, that seems to hang for me too and now I can't access the main page. I did and upgrade as well, and it wanted me to reboot. Just to eliminate that possiblity, though unlikely, I'm going to reboot. | 17:02 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, seems it treated this as a wiki page but not a static file: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/Images/6/64/World.swf | 17:02 |
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| haoyu | wow, that's cool... | 17:03 |
| haoyu | firefox upgrade caused access problem... | 17:04 |
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| ankitg | Yep with FF 3.8 I get "No file by this name exists, but you can upload one." for File:CC.png but File:Cc.png just does nothing for a long while and then throws a DB error ... | 17:06 |
| ankitg | Database error | 17:07 |
| ankitg | A database query syntax error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software. The last attempted database query was: | 17:07 |
| ankitg | (SQL query hidden) | 17:07 |
| ankitg | from within function "". MySQL returned error "1205: Lock wait timeout exceeded; try restarting transaction (localhost)". | 17:07 |
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| nkinkade | haoyu: I'm getting a MySQL error when I try to access File:Cc.png | 17:12 |
| nkinkade | ankitg: What you said. :-) | 17:12 |
| nkinkade | Sorry, didn't read your post before I wrote. | 17:12 |
| haoyu | Aslo, should this be linked to the file I upload: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/Images/6/64/World.swf | 17:13 |
| haoyu | but seems it is treated as a wiki page | 17:13 |
| ankitg | haoyu: you probably need to create a div container and ember the flash there ... | 17:13 |
| ankitg | *embed even | 17:14 |
| haoyu | but you should able to get this file atleast.. I think | 17:14 |
| nkinkade | The <flash></flash> tags don't work? | 17:14 |
| nkinkade | It looks like rewrite error. | 17:15 |
| nkinkade | It's getting passed to index.php ... notice how the I in image gets capitalized. | 17:15 |
| nkinkade | Let me check on that. | 17:15 |
| ankitg | haoyu: the file is here :: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/File:World.swf | 17:15 |
| ankitg | haoyu: try using the <flash> tags as suggested to use the flash plugin to embed this into a wiki page | 17:16 |
| ankitg | nkinkade: the file is here :: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/File:World.swf | 17:17 |
| haoyu | could you really see that file by this link? | 17:17 |
| ankitg | yep | 17:17 |
| ankitg | World.swf (file size: 174 KB, MIME type: application/x-shockwave-flash) | 17:18 |
| haoyu | That's the wiki page of the file, but not the really file I think | 17:18 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: Sorry, I had a bad RewriteCond rule ... try again: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/images/6/64/World.swf | 17:18 |
| haoyu | When you click the World.swf link, you dont' accually get the file | 17:18 |
| ankitg | haoyu: oh here then :: http://monitor.creativecommons.org/images/6/64/World.swf | 17:18 |
| haoyu | yes now it works :) | 17:18 |
| nkinkade | But there is definitely something still broken about File:Cc.png | 17:20 |
| haoyu | Everytime I am tring to upload an image file the firefox will hang on the monitor site... | 17:26 |
| haoyu | and then restart firefox solve this... | 17:27 |
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| JanisB | nathany, correct me if i am wrong - RDF plugin should provide new fields (aka interface) in blog-post management window and after commiting changes regenerate site.rdf file, which contains semantic information about all entities in blog. Fields for site.rdf descriptions and it's values can be either selected from early-created vocabularies or added manually by authors. | 17:35 |
| nathany | JanisB: no | 17:36 |
| nathany | it's RDFa (the "a" is important) | 17:36 |
| JanisB | :( | 17:36 |
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| nathany | it should allow authors to embed metadata in the XHTML they author | 17:36 |
| nathany | so it's an extension to the text editor specifically | 17:37 |
| nathany | (not new fields) | 17:37 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: I removed the Cc.png file and it's page. | 17:37 |
| nkinkade | It would seem as if there were some hung MySQL threads that had a lock on that table row for the CC.png page. | 17:38 |
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| nkinkade | Before it wouldn't even let me delete the row from the table. I killed the mysql thread (didn't know about mysql> KILL before!) and it seemed to fix it. | 17:38 |
| haoyu | so could I try to upload an image again? | 17:39 |
| haoyu | is the probelm caused by the problematic rewrite? | 17:40 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: It shouldn't be. I fixed the rewrite rule about 30 minutes ago. | 17:41 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, I tried to upload image and it hang again | 17:41 |
| JanisB | nathany, but there's not so many possible fields available in every post - author/title/text/post date/tags/smth. else and that's all... Or an idea is to implement new BB-style codes in editor to markup significant parts of post and therefore generate RDF-attributes for "upstream" XHTML tags? | 17:43 |
| nathany | JanisB: no, not BB-style codes... ideally I think there'd be a button like the hyperlink button that let's you either insert new metadata-enhanced text or modifies the selected text | 17:44 |
| nkinkade | haoyu: I'm going to step out for a minute to get lunch. I'll look at it in a while. | 17:44 |
| nathany | the interface would let you select what the predicate is (hence the "easy", pre-defined vocabularies) | 17:45 |
| nathany | and insert it in the editor with XHTML+RDFa | 17:45 |
| haoyu | nkinkade, okey it's fine. however we don't need image uploading so much. :p | 17:45 |
| nathany | this should be straight forward with the straight up XHTML editor; making it "pretty" in the visual editor will probably be much more difficult | 17:45 |
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| JanisB | I think it is possible to highlight (e.g. change background) different pieces of text that represents predicates, because it is not RDF tags by themselves, it is just "patched" version of XHTML... | 17:50 |
| JanisB | and then each highlighted entry will have it's own attributes to describe predicate | 17:51 |
| nathany | yup | 17:51 |
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| * paulproteus waves | 18:12 | |
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| Bovinity | nathany: mlinksva: mixt greens? | 19:07 |
| nathany | Bovinity: sure | 19:07 |
| mlinksva | ok | 19:08 |
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| paulproteus | nathany, Possibly chat on the phone re: interns? | 19:12 |
| cristi | hello nathany | 19:21 |
| cristi | hello everyone | 19:21 |
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| paulproteus | Hello cristi. | 19:28 |
| paulproteus | haoyu, Can you try doing the upload via an SSH tunnel? | 19:29 |
| paulproteus | I wonder if there's some evil network monkeying in the middle. | 19:29 |
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| paulproteus | nathany, Let me know if you're around (and also possibly phoneable) | 20:13 |
| paulproteus | Otherwise I'll give you my thoughts about interns by email, which is okay. | 20:13 |
| JanisB | nathany, I am writing proposal for this RDFa plugin. Should I write something in "feedback on #cc" field? | 20:19 |
| nathany | JanisB: you can write that you've spoken to nathany there. Maybe include your nic so I remember who you are. | 20:21 |
| JanisB | okay | 20:21 |
| nathany | paulproteus: just got back from lunch | 20:22 |
| nathany | i can call if you like | 20:22 |
| paulproteus | I think that'd be easier for me to be expressive on and to see what you're thinking on, if it's not too much trouble. | 20:23 |
| paulproteus | Just ring my cell in e.g. 60s? | 20:23 |
| nathany | sure | 20:23 |
| paulproteus | Great. | 20:24 |
| nkinkade | nathany: Should the string deed.moralrights-remix.us apply to other licenses other than the US? | 21:08 |
| nkinkade | It seems to apply. | 21:08 |
| nathany | nkinkade: i don't remember; what seems wrong to you? | 21:08 |
| nathany | we have deed.moralrights that's the default, -remix.us only applies in certain circumstances, i think | 21:09 |
| nkinkade | There's something funny on the Thai By Deed: | 21:09 |
| nkinkade | http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/th/ | 21:09 |
| nkinkade | That part has the wrong string. | 21:09 |
| nkinkade | I'm looking to see if somehow something happened in the PO file. | 21:09 |
| nathany | that's all in thai | 21:09 |
| nathany | are you referring to the email from the other night? | 21:10 |
| nkinkade | But there's a link. | 21:10 |
| nathany | so both are growing links | 21:10 |
| nkinkade | The link doesn't appear in the other's I've seen. | 21:10 |
| nkinkade | Ah, that's something new? The link, that is. | 21:10 |
| nathany | because they haven't regenerated (or updated their i18n) | 21:10 |
| nathany | yeah | 21:10 |
| nathany | this is more pain from my merging stuff | 21:10 |
| nathany | so if you can just override deed.moralright in the th catalog we can regenerate and move on (i think) | 21:11 |
| nathany | i think the string you want is deed.moralrights | 21:11 |
| nathany | nkinkade: does that make sense? | 21:12 |
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| nathany | paulproteus: what does the pootle precommit do again? | 21:14 |
| nkinkade | nathany: Somewhat. But who hasn't regenerated? | 21:15 |
| nkinkade | They regenerated themselves via Pootle? | 21:15 |
| nathany | nkinkade: i mean the other deeds | 21:15 |
| paulproteus | It runs the po2cc | 21:15 |
| nathany | so they haven't got the updated strings | 21:15 |
| nathany | paulproteus: oh... so postcommit just updates staging and restarts zope? | 21:16 |
| paulproteus | Ya | 21:16 |
| nathany | sorry, i was confused | 21:16 |
| nathany | definitely precommit then | 21:16 |
| paulproteus | Right-o. | 21:16 |
| nkinkade | nathany: So the Thai Deed as far as you can tell is fine. | 21:16 |
| nkinkade | That part should in fact have a link to the FAQ? | 21:17 |
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| nathany | nkinkade: the construction of the sentence changed as well so probably not (i don't read thai) | 21:18 |
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| nathany | nkinkade: i can go ahead and update/regenerate | 21:18 |
| nathany | that might be easier :) | 21:19 |
| nkinkade | nathany: Maybe, I'm slightly confused for some reason. | 21:20 |
| nathany | well, it's confusing | 21:20 |
| nathany | (and thai) | 21:20 |
| nkinkade | nathany: FYI, I've been working with Victor for the last 2 hours getting PHP upgraded to version 5 for mixter. | 21:20 |
| nathany | nkinkade: ugh | 21:20 |
| nkinkade | On an old CentOS box it hasn't been totally as easy as with Debian. | 21:20 |
| nathany | ok... | 21:21 |
| nkinkade | Had to abandon a compiled version of Apache 2.2.3 and go to using the system version 2.0.52. | 21:21 |
| nathany | why were we helping? | 21:21 |
| nathany | (just curious) | 21:21 |
| nkinkade | Anyway, just wanted to let you know that's what I've been up to. | 21:21 |
| nathany | sure | 21:21 |
| nkinkade | nathany: Are we not supposed to be doing that? | 21:21 |
| nathany | eh, mixter is almost absolute zero on the priority list | 21:22 |
| nathany | it's fine but it's a total sinkhole | 21:22 |
| nkinkade | Ah. Well, it all had to with Victor wanting to implement OpenID, but needed PHP5 for that. | 21:22 |
| nkinkade | Anyway, it's pretty much done. He's just ironing our a few kinks. | 21:22 |
| nathany | ok, cool | 21:22 |
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| nathany | great | 21:23 |
| Bovinity | nathany: some intently made tweaks/progress to the cc wp theme: http://10.0.2.178/~bse/wordpress/ | 21:38 |
| nathany | i generally like -- not sure i 100% love the full horizontal bars between sections but looks great overall | 21:38 |
| nathany | Bovinity: ^^ | 21:38 |
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| mlinksva | Bovinity: sidebar link to 100m blog post is missing /entry in path | 23:03 |
| mlinksva | https://support.creativecommons.org/join | 23:03 |
| Bovinity | ah, bugger. | 23:04 |
| Bovinity | on it | 23:04 |
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| nathany | svn up | 23:38 |
| nathany | er | 23:38 |
| nathany | nkinkade: have we been using trunk for license.rdf for... a long time on production? | 23:38 |
| nathany | that doesn't sound right to me for some reason | 23:38 |
| nathany | but i won't swear that it hasn't always been the case | 23:39 |
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