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| CharelB | Hello. | 06:18 |
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| hdworak | hi, CharelB | 07:31 |
| hdworak | what's up? | 07:31 |
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| * greg-g yawns | 08:41 | |
| tvol_ | morning greg-g | 08:42 |
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| greg-g | heya tvol_ | 08:44 |
| greg-g | and yes, it is early out here, have an interview to do at 7am | 08:45 |
| tvol_ | geez crazy where is the interviewee? | 08:46 |
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| greg-g | over the phone, he is in the UK though | 08:46 |
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| CharelB | o0 | 08:58 |
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| paulproteus | nathany - let's talk priorities for today if you have a sec. | 09:36 |
| * paulproteus checks out teamspace tasks | 09:36 | |
| nathany | paulproteus: sure | 09:37 |
| nathany | do you want to tell me what you think they are and i'll correct, or vice versa? | 09:37 |
| paulproteus | I was thinking I'd tell you; gimme a few minutes to figure out what I think they are. (-: | 09:38 |
| nathany | ok, just alert my irc client when you're ready | 09:38 |
| paulproteus | Also, whaddya say to the early morning bakery drive Wed? I'd be happy to buy for everyone, and we (== I) could call ahead with an order so they'd be ready when we get there. | 09:39 |
| nathany | i think i'm "no" on a bakery drive; goog is going to have breakfast for us and I'm loathe to introduce anything else into that day's schedule | 09:41 |
| paulproteus | Duly noted, I'll make a run on that bakery another time. | 09:42 |
| nathany | sound great | 09:43 |
| paulproteus | http://teamspace.creativecommons.org/Map_for_ccLearn is done. There are more Fedora liblicense issues to work out, and dgilmore did say he would sponsor me. | 09:43 |
| paulproteus | So if I can catch him, then today seems a good day to handle those, and also Herder's JS suggestion UI, and if that gets done, Herder's auth. | 09:44 |
| paulproteus | The EOG and Rhythmbox plugins can wait. | 09:44 |
| paulproteus | I might do well to diagnose some liblicense build failures on Ubuntu - there's something weird about the packages that prevents a clean build on Ubuntu, and it would be probably good to push them into a repository for us crazy Ubuntu users. | 09:45 |
| paulproteus | I can block out not more than an hour for that. | 09:45 |
| paulproteus | nathany, ^^ is my thinking for today - liblicense Ubuntu packages, liblicense Fedora packages, Herder suggestion JS UI, Herder auth (hopefully). | 09:46 |
| paulproteus | http://teamspace.creativecommons.org/Map_for_ccLearn is done for me, at least | 09:46 |
| paulproteus | I'll mark as "low priority today, high priority Tuesday" figuring out the stats issues ML and Giorgos have been talking about. | 09:48 |
| nathany | paulproteus: that seems mostly sane; i'd probably order them fedora, herder JS, ubuntu, herder auth | 09:49 |
| nathany | since we have external people blocking on fedora | 09:49 |
| nathany | (unfortunately) | 09:49 |
| paulproteus | Duly noted. | 09:50 |
| nathany | and i'd appreciate it if you made stats super-high priority tomorrow (ie, if things don't get done today from this list, slip them to post-tech-summit) | 09:50 |
| nathany | when are you heading back? | 09:50 |
| paulproteus | Tuesday night, arriving 9 PM. | 09:50 |
| paulproteus | I can do that re: stats. | 09:50 |
| nathany | cool | 09:50 |
| nathany | sounds great | 09:51 |
| nathany | super great, even ;) | 09:51 |
| paulproteus | lol! | 09:51 |
| greg-g | "super green!" | 09:51 |
| nathany | paulproteus: btw, why "liblicense2"? | 09:52 |
| paulproteus | nathany, ABI versioning. | 09:52 |
| nathany | ah | 09:52 |
| paulproteus | I've already changed the ABI from 0 to 1 to 2 in the past, like, six months. | 09:52 |
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| paulproteus | Before I took over, there was no SONAME metadata at all, so there was no promise that if you linked against liblicense you wouldn't later get a version that caused random segfaults. | 09:53 |
| nathany | maybe i'm just now aware of debian naming guidelines... i figured the "foo[n]" name would match "foo[n]-dev" | 09:53 |
| nathany | oh, i see liblicense-dev depends on liblicense2 | 09:53 |
| paulproteus | Nah, the idea is that at build time, any version might do; but at runtime, you will segfault unless you get one that guarantees a stable ABI. | 09:54 |
| paulproteus | At least, at build time, you will know if a version *won't* do; and the build will fail. | 09:54 |
| paulproteus | Whereas runtime segfaults for your users is a drag. | 09:54 |
| nathany | right on | 09:55 |
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| rejon | greg-g: 5 min come over plz :) | 12:16 |
| paulproteus | Hey, it's mecredis_x60s in the office! | 12:17 |
| mecredis_x60s | indeed | 12:17 |
| paulproteus | How are you, gentleman? | 12:17 |
| mecredis_x60s | its 'off and running by itself | 12:17 |
| greg-g | rejon: you in the small room? | 12:17 |
| rejon | yah | 12:19 |
| greg-g | coo | 12:19 |
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| paulproteus | mecredis_x60s, Any further HOPE thought? | 12:24 |
| mecredis_x60s | well it seems like they have these workshop things | 12:24 |
| mecredis_x60s | http://www.thelasthope.org/speak.php | 12:24 |
| mecredis_x60s | we could do a general CC one | 12:25 |
| mecredis_x60s | or something more sinister? | 12:28 |
| paulproteus | I was thinking more like a lecture: "It's fun to steal / but sharing is daring - a five-year retrospective on Creative Commons, and why hackers should care" | 12:29 |
| paulproteus | With one of the early points being, "Sure, it's fun to hack binaries, but you can do a lot more if you have the source code" | 12:29 |
| paulproteus | Admittedly, it could easily be Far Too Late for that. | 12:30 |
| mecredis_x60s | right | 12:30 |
| mecredis_x60s | but what differentiates that from a GPL lecture | 12:30 |
| mecredis_x60s | I think people *get* the GPL | 12:30 |
| mecredis_x60s | and sadly, some at HOPE are kind of indifferent | 12:30 |
| mecredis_x60s | I did a "hacking culture" talk there a while ago | 12:31 |
| paulproteus | Well, two things if we wanted: (a) details on using CC licenses, and how that differs from FSF licenses (attribution? anti-drm clause?!), and (b) details on good current places to get+share CC content, and a big ol' metrics graph. | 12:32 |
| paulproteus | What was your hacking culture talk like? | 12:32 |
| paulproteus | I also secretly think that this HOPE will be filled with lame wannabes who know comparatively little about CC (among other things). | 12:34 |
| mecredis_x60s | right | 12:36 |
| mecredis_x60s | my hacking culture talk was just the same ole | 12:36 |
| mecredis_x60s | but yeah, if we go a little more tech centric and focus on the licenses | 12:37 |
| paulproteus | Is it "culture of hackers" or "attacking culture with hacks"? | 12:37 |
| mecredis_x60s | haha, yeah, the latter | 12:37 |
| paulproteus | Okay, great (-: | 12:37 |
| paulproteus | biella could do the former. (-; | 12:37 |
| mecredis_x60s | indeed | 12:37 |
| mecredis_x60s | so maybe you could get into the tech details | 12:38 |
| mecredis_x60s | I can talk the cultural projects | 12:38 |
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| paulproteus | So long as we think we can fill the time. (-: | 12:40 |
| mecredis_x60s | I mean I'm happy to do a workshop | 12:42 |
| mecredis_x60s | it's probably more laid back, requires less prep, and is easier to fill time with | 12:42 |
| paulproteus | I guess I'm a little confused as to what a workshop means. | 12:43 |
| paulproteus | But I would be happy to share in that, especially if it wasn't on Saturday (when I might skip out to Coney Island for that music festival). | 12:44 |
| mecredis_x60s | yeah, they kind of have a brief description | 12:45 |
| mecredis_x60s | but my guess is that we'll get a couple people interested in CC licenses | 12:46 |
| mecredis_x60s | and some random folk | 12:46 |
| mecredis_x60s | and just jam | 12:46 |
| paulproteus | Party time. | 12:46 |
| paulproteus | I like. | 12:46 |
| mecredis_x60s | aight | 12:46 |
| mecredis_x60s | I'll drop them a line | 12:46 |
| mecredis_x60s | and CC you | 12:46 |
| paulproteus | Great, and feel free to mention that I volunteered for an EFF patent busting project in 2008 and was involved in OPG v. Diebold in '04. (-: | 12:47 |
| paulproteus | (tech paper on eff.org pending me getting around to co-writing it) | 12:47 |
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| paulproteus | (but it's the tech work for http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2008/06/patent-office-cant-do-it-all-alone | 12:48 |
| paulproteus | ) | 12:48 |
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| mecredis_x60s | paulproteus: what's your title? | 12:49 |
| paulproteus | Software Engineer, I think. | 12:50 |
| paulproteus | I think my card and the website disagree on this issue. | 12:50 |
| paulproteus | Maybe I should just get nathany to change my title to "hack". | 12:50 |
| nathany | what does the website say? | 12:50 |
| nathany | should be Software Engineer | 12:51 |
| nathany | :) | 12:51 |
| paulproteus | Software Developer I've seen around. | 12:51 |
| paulproteus | http://209.85.141.104/search?q=cache:UtgDJXCnBj0J:creativecommons.org/about/people+asheesh+%22software+developer%22+creative-commons&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&client=firefox-a says "developer" | 12:51 |
| paulproteus | I'd edit it, but I live in fear of messing up the formatting in WordPress on that page. | 12:51 |
| mecredis_x60s | done | 12:52 |
| bovinity | didn't you break it once before? :P | 12:52 |
| nathany | heh | 12:52 |
| nathany | *that* can be your title -- "breaker of shiny things" | 12:52 |
| paulproteus | Ouch. | 12:52 |
| nathany | ;) | 12:52 |
| paulproteus | That hurts. | 12:52 |
| paulproteus | Because it's true. | 12:52 |
| nathany | (i kid because i love) | 12:52 |
| paulproteus | (yes, but love whom?) | 12:53 |
| nathany | uh... everyone? | 12:53 |
| paulproteus | Good answer. | 12:54 |
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| bovinity | damn, another pot? | 12:56 |
| nathany | ++ | 12:56 |
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| bovinity | paulproteus: you're an engineer now. | 12:58 |
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| bovinity | mecredis_x60s: you're a Culture Program Associate, too | 12:59 |
| paulproteus | If only it were always that easy. | 12:59 |
| mecredis_x60s | indeed | 12:59 |
| mecredis_x60s | tjhanks | 12:59 |
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| paulproteus | That's some serious rain. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Wow. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Squirrels running for cover. | 13:01 |
| paulproteus | Thunder. | 13:01 |
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| paulproteus | HAIL!? | 13:07 |
| paulproteus | In June!? | 13:07 |
| nathany | puh-leas | 13:07 |
| nathany | welcome to the midwest | 13:07 |
| bovinity | SF has the cold and miserable. | 13:07 |
| paulproteus | Big balls of ice. | 13:07 |
| paulproteus | Huh. | 13:07 |
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| bovinity | paulproteus: what is it with you and bakeries? ;) | 13:14 |
| paulproteus | (-: | 13:15 |
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| bovinity | http://www.threadless.com/product/1309/Playing_God | 14:03 |
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| nathany | mecredis_x60s: http://mehfilindian.com/LunchMenuTakeOut.htm | 14:09 |
| paulproteus | mecredis_x60s, Don't do it! | 14:12 |
| paulproteus | Eat quiche! | 14:12 |
| paulproteus | Also, wow bovinity. | 14:12 |
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| bovinity | paulproteus: hmm? | 15:04 |
| paulproteus | bovinity, "wow" re: Playing God | 15:04 |
| bovinity | ah, yeah | 15:04 |
| paulproteus | This time zone thing is really throwing me off. | 15:05 |
| mecredis_x60s | yeah, master becomes slave | 15:05 |
| nkinkade | nathany: paulproteus: I just moved i.CC.org to a8 and changed DNS. In the meantime, there is a ProxyPass rule on a5 and also an entry in /etc/hosts so that it thinks i.CC.org is a8 until it's own DNS converges. | 15:06 |
| nkinkade | I just mention this so that if something strange happens you'll know what to attribute it to. | 15:06 |
| paulproteus | Yay. | 15:06 |
| paulproteus | nkinkade, Yeah, it'll be attributed to me. (-; | 15:06 |
| nkinkade | The one thing I don't yet understand is why there is an average of 500KB/sec going out on a5 and only around 50KB/sec on a8. | 15:07 |
| nathany | bovinity: mecredis_x60s: http://youtube.com/watch?v=8uwuLxrv8jY | 15:08 |
| nkinkade | I can't imagine that the other sites hosted on a5 would be generating 450KB/s of traffic. | 15:08 |
| nathany | greg-g: ^^ | 15:08 |
| nathany | (the link i pasted to you tube) | 15:08 |
| bovinity | holy crap, saved by the bell brokeback, http://youtube.com/watch?v=yHLr5AYl5f4&feature=related | 15:08 |
| rejon | hahhaha | 15:09 |
| paulproteus | nkinkade, reloaded apache...? (does access.log/varnish indicate it's serving out those images?) | 15:09 |
| paulproteus | BTW, http://www.circlemud.org/~jelson/software/tcpflow/ is nicer than straight-up tcpdump, I've discovered. | 15:10 |
| bovinity | "last night at the movies, you went too far" | 15:11 |
| nkinkade | paulproteus: Yeah, the log is filling up on a8 at about the same rate as on a5. | 15:11 |
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| nkinkade | I tried to fetch this image yonkinkade.png from i.CC.org and it showed up in the logs on a8. | 15:11 |
| paulproteus | lol! | 15:12 |
| paulproteus | re: yokinkade | 15:12 |
| paulproteus | re: yoNkinkade | 15:12 |
| nkinkade | maybe that should have been yonath@nkink.de.png | 15:12 |
| nkinkade | But I'm still confused about the discrepancy in traffic volume, but maybe not enough to really delve into it as long as images are getting served up. | 15:13 |
| nkinkade | Also, a nice little Firefox plugin called Show IP tells me that the IP address of images I fetch frim i.CC.org is the IP of a8. | 15:14 |
| paulproteus | nkinkade, bovinity, especially: http://www.slowwave.com/index.php?date=08-05-17 | 15:15 |
| nathany | http://youtube.com/watch?v=-wcK8GhPh-I | 15:16 |
| nkinkade | Oh, wait. Duh. The discrepancy must be Varnish serving up most everything from cache, so the requests never hit the ProxyPass rule in Apache. | 15:17 |
| bovinity | nathany: which reminds me.. http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/funny-pictures-cat-trains-about-ceiling-cat-door.jpg | 15:17 |
| paulproteus | nkinkade, D'oh. Smartie pants Varnish. | 15:18 |
| bovinity | http://icanhascheezburger.com/2008/06/15/funny-pictures-kitten-u-got-2-be-akwittin/ | 15:19 |
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| greg-g | paulproteus: I'm assuming the mirrors.cc repo doesn't have amd64 builds huh? | 16:08 |
| greg-g | <insert plug for Launchpad's PPAs here> | 16:12 |
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| greg-g | sidenote: getting the gpg key error from the mirrors.cc repo reminded me, KEY SIGNING PARTY! ;) | 16:24 |
| nkinkade | paulproteus: I realized at lunch in the world of Varnish, ProxyPass is irrelevant and inferior when it comes to what we've been using it form | 16:28 |
| nkinkade | Varnish can be configured to use as many backends as you like, and which backend it uses can be based on virtually anything you want, including the host name the client sends. | 16:28 |
| nkinkade | The problem with ProxyPass (maybe there is a config I don't know about) is that it alters the header information, so I had to add a line to /etc/hosts so that it would set the host to i.CC.org. Varnish doesn't do that when it connects to a backend ... it passes the information untouched. | 16:30 |
| nkinkade | The other downside of ProxyPass is that until DNS fully converges we'll have split logs, some things logged on a5 by Varnish and some by Varnish and Apache on a8. | 16:31 |
| nkinkade | Maybe that should have been a teamspace page, or an email. /me goes back to work. | 16:32 |
| nathany | Steren: http://teamspace.creativecommons.org/Mobile_stylesheet_for_deeds.#tab=Factbox | 16:39 |
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| paulproteus | nkinkade, Yes, I always hacked /etc/hosts that way. | 17:39 |
| paulproteus | When I did the ProxyPassing before. | 17:40 |
| paulproteus | greg-g, Do Ubuntu's PPAs also build for Debian unstable? | 17:40 |
| paulproteus | I know fairly little about the PPAs. | 17:40 |
| nkinkade | Just to test my theory I removed the entry from the hosts file and also commented out the ProxyPass rule. | 17:40 |
| nkinkade | It's still working fine, but I'm very confused about why the access.log on a5 is still growing. | 17:40 |
| paulproteus | DNS is changed? | 17:41 |
| paulproteus | Wait, a5. | 17:41 |
| paulproteus | Oh, whatevs. | 17:41 |
| nkinkade | Some requests are going to a8, but Varnish is still sending some requests to the local Apache. | 17:41 |
| nkinkade | I'm not sure why because I've told it to send *everything* to host i.creativecommons.org to the new backend which Apache on a8. | 17:41 |
| mecredis_x60s | . | 17:42 |
| nkinkade | I was fretting over if for a few minutes, but I've moved on ... it's all working and when DNS converges there shouldn't be an issue. | 17:42 |
| paulproteus | I've moved on also. | 17:45 |
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| greg-g | paulproteus: no, just Ubuntu, but for all architectures | 17:48 |
| greg-g | paulproteus: I believe building for debian is "in the works" | 17:49 |
| paulproteus | "gee, thanks" | 17:51 |
| paulproteus | Should be easy for me to make qemu-based pbuilder. | 17:51 |
| paulproteus | But I need to find a letter I misplaced for my parents. | 17:52 |
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| nathany | paulproteus: git question? | 19:43 |
| paulproteus | nathany, Sure | 19:43 |
| paulproteus | There exists #git | 19:44 |
| nathany | :) | 19:44 |
| nathany | true | 19:44 |
| paulproteus | Also I have my Dad's T40 open right in front of me. | 19:44 |
| paulproteus | Gotta melt the GPU. | 19:44 |
| paulproteus | But anyway go ahead. | 19:44 |
| nathany | but i don't feel so bad about asking you w/o trying to find the docs | 19:44 |
| nathany | lol | 19:44 |
| * paulproteus chuckles | 19:44 | |
| paulproteus | BTW, eg looks quite reasonable. | 19:44 |
| paulproteus | I'm going to migrate to it I think. | 19:44 |
| paulproteus | eg for subversion users is the docs that are good. | 19:44 |
| nathany | cool | 19:44 |
| nathany | so i have a repository with slides from my semtech talk | 19:45 |
| paulproteus | http://www.gnome.org/~newren/eg/git-for-svn-users.html there we are. | 19:45 |
| nathany | i want to create a new batch of slides for the summit, based on those | 19:45 |
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| nathany | so i did git clone of the first repos | 19:45 |
| nathany | made some changes, committed | 19:45 |
| nathany | then tried to do git push git@code.cc.org:techsummit_ccrel.git | 19:46 |
| nathany | which barfed | 19:46 |
| nathany | (i think i know the answer to this) | 19:46 |
| nathany | do i just need to do a git remote add ... first? | 19:46 |
| nathany | or is my approach fundamentally flawed | 19:46 |
| paulproteus | You should git remote add. | 19:46 |
| paulproteus | Are you creating a new branch? | 19:46 |
| paulproteus | Right, I see now. | 19:47 |
| paulproteus | Yes, that way is okay. | 19:47 |
| nathany | i was thinking i'd basically start a new project based on the old one | 19:47 |
| paulproteus | But you could always just create a local branch that has the modifications and store that in the same repo as your semtech slides as a branch. | 19:47 |
| paulproteus | Sure, that's okay too. | 19:47 |
| paulproteus | I'd call it excessive. | 19:47 |
| nathany | :) | 19:47 |
| paulproteus | But I have no quarrel with it. | 19:47 |
| nathany | ok, i'll consider the branch approach | 19:47 |
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